Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums General Petroliana Discussion New to Hobby. First Question.

Being new to the hobby and having caught the bug pretty bad, I have what I see as a very good question. One that has probably been asked many times though. How do you really tell a true vintage from a repro in a porcelain sign? A great example are all the pump signs that you see out there. To better refine the example, all the Texaco FireChief signs that I see. There will be 5-10 for sale on ebay at any given time. How can I know that they are true vintage?
Thanks for the help!!!!
And damn this is addicting

fortunately the old ones are dated lower right corner
if thats missing or has a 90 date, beware
welcome to the madness!

Welcome, I've had this sickness for over twenty years! Sometimes it's worse than drugs! LOL. Your question is sound. Texaco was in business a long time and had a bunch of signs made. That explains the amount available at most times. As stated above, watch for the date in the lower right corner. Although not always accurate, condition will help too. Have someone show you, at a show, how to determine the shelving on a sign. Heavy shelving usually,indicates an older sign. Also look closely for screen print edges instead of brush edges. If screen edges are present, the sign is a later circa. Could be remade? Regards,Paul www.severngaspumps.com

Enjoy the hobby, I have for over 30 years now damn I am old! The bug attacked me hard back in the day. You can tell a repop sometimes by the thickness of the sign compared to an original. The repops not always but for the most part are a thinner sign and not as heavy....but the best advice RESEARCH. You will find that the hunt and meeting new folks is the best part of it.

Welcome to OLDGAS..You might consider rehab because it only gets worse- No known cure..

someone commented that luckily the date is in the lower right corner......oh....not so true! sometimes there are dates and sometimes there are not!

just because there is no date on the sign doesn't mean its not an original.

lots and lots and lots of signs that are real with no date.

the only way to know if it is real is EXPERIENCE......KNOWLEDGE....

AND HERES THE ONE THAT YOU WILL LEARN THE MOST FROM.....

BUY A FAKE THINKING ITS REAL!!!!

Alot of the time you just know when you are holding it in your hands.....

depends on what old is--all my 1940's are dated in left
hand corner---

thanks guys. Yes research!! I can see this and have been doing that with some success. For now the only thing I trust are vintage pictures. One of my first questions came up when I noticed a difference in the text style of the small "a" in "Mobilgas" on pump signs. Some have an "a" that looks like this one I just typed, but others have an "a" that does not curl over the top. It has a staight line down the left side. It is seeming to me now that they are both real but just from different era's with the curled over the top ones being older. True??

In my opinion, (and shared by others in the hobby for more than a month!) dates don't always mean original. For instance the PURE and Standard Red/White Crown plates. All have an "old" IR date but are new repros. There are several tips already mentioned that are a start to identifying real signs, but it just comes with experience in the hobby.
Fortunately the Texaco plates are pretty easy to tell an original from repro, but other brands are problems for new collectors. As Marx stated, most Texaco's are dated in the lower right, while the early 1940's production year versions are in the lower left as Deacon stated.
If you really feel a need to clarify a purchase, BEFORE buying it, ask on Old Gas and get others opinions on the sign.
Darin

And yes, the "curled" top A Mobilgas plates are older than the regular A versions. And yes, both are original versions.
Darin

I've posted this before,but since you are new to our group i'll do it again.I recommend that you order cataloges from both Vics66 and Gas Pump Heaven as soon as possible.They will show you what is immediately available in repop signs;not just pump plates.

For instance,Vics sells pop plates Texaco Firechief,Sky Chief,red Diesel Cheif and Indian.In addition to those they also sell two versions of Pure,two versions of Mobilgas,two versions of Shamrock,a Sinclair,a Flying A and a Blue Sunoco as well as Standard Red and White Crown.And those are just the pump plates.

I think those two catalogs anong with PCM's pump restoration book will answer a lot of questions that will come up in the future.Good luck.

Welcome to Oldgas.com!

It is probably a good idea to delay starting your collection for a few months while you are educating yourself by researching the current reproduction catalogs and resource books.

There is no substitute for knowledge and experience. "An ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure." That has never held more truth then in the current e-Bay market that is saturated with sellers selling reproduction signs as originals.

Don't be afraid to ask questions, that is how we all learn.

First things first, pictures online are one place to start, but nothing beats seeing signs in person... sooooo... find a local sign collector who is here on Oldgas who might be willing to mentor you and show you some of their original signs. And try to get out to one of the local sign shows in your region, that will really help you learn alot.

((Dates on signs sometimes aren't dates but rather sign codes, so they aren't a 100% guarantee of authenticity. ))

Second, you'll find alot of repro's are single sided with often grainy grey-black backs as doing both sides is much more difficult. Original signs were often covered in the main background color then overlaid with successive colors to come up with the final product. This normally causes "ledging" where you'll see a difference in depth from color layer to color layer. Many repros are single layer signs due to their process. Also, you'll note that many repro/fantasy signs may have been artificially aged by chipping in the surface, around mounting holes, etc. Original signs tended to rust in these areas but modern metals have more anti-corrosion alloys so they don't tend to show any rust.

Third, if you are unsure about a sign's originality, if you're dealing with a local seller make sure they'll agree to take the sign back if you're not satisfied.

Fourth, buy what you like, even some repros are cool to hang, just take the time to engrave/mark on the back side that they are a repro.

Fifth, have fun looking for some great signs!

Thanks all for the advice. Most of it seems like common sense, which I realize. In the end, if I get burned then it is what it is. So far I have 100% confidence in what I've bought. I can already tell that my heart leans toward pieces that have a degree of age. The older the better for me. I love the history!! And condition, although important, isn't expected to be perfect.
Old Iron, I will certainly look up the two book/catalogs you mentioned.

Something just hit me that I need to clarify. For the most part I'm pretty sure I can pick out most repro's if I saw it in person. However, my true concern is this. And this was how I should have worded my original question. Are there any manufactures making signs JUST LIKE the original manufactures did? With the same thicknesses and the same porcelain processes?? So that although just like the originals, they dont have the history?