well i gotta mention i just bought two visible's(176's)I have found good deals for them in the past 3 years i've been collecting but just could'nt afford shipping.I have a ton of elec's and only 1 wayne 615 until now.Dar Hansen outa Iowa was kind enough to bring them all the way to N.M. for free,so i bought the 2 176's and a t-65 ,cant beat that.Its great to know this hobby has people like him,course he delivered in CO. too.Thanks alot Dar! Mike