Here is a copy on an e-mail, that I recently recieved.....

Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 367
Location: Dwaine Buck, Big Valley, California
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 7:18 am Post subject:

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Good Morning to you. Been working on some globe art, Fargo oil Co, from Colorado.
Glad your feeling better Cheese.
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Its things like this, that prevent a lot of people, from posting pics here on Oldgas.... Because of this, I have deleted my Far-go pics, from the current C.O.T.M. feature. It is without a doubt, that these people, have already copied these images, and started in their, immoral, unethical, reproduction of these globes, and/or decals. I have already been in contact with Jim Treadway, at T-ways Graphics, so that we could reproduce these images, and started these discussions, about a month ago. We have already started to check with the appropriate parties, so that we could reproduce these WITHOUT infringing on any copyrights and/or ownerships. I was hoping that my discovery, of the Far-Go decal, would be a benefit to those of us interested in local companies. I was also hoping that this image, would be handled in a better way, than the Powerine "Bearcat" image, which I also found. Apparently I was incorrect in hoping that the images would NOT be copied.

And unlike the last time, that I commented about a similar situation, if you have any comments about this, POST it here, so that everybody can see it. NO MORE INSULTS ABOUT MY MOTHER! You know who you are!

It is my opinion, that this theivery of images, should be addressed.

[This message has been edited by Thunder II (edited 02-13-2008).]

I understand your drift, but I really don't understand what is going on. I went to the link, but it said under construction, I don't understand why I was looking at this. Can you explain this a little better without naming names, etc.
Jack Sim

Simply put Jack... There are people, that will copy images posted here, and make decals, signs and/or globes, of those images, without permission of the owners. I had posted pics of a few Far-Go items, in the C.O.T.M. feature. I was planning on reproducing these, after I found out if it would be legal to do so. Somebody else took it upon himself to say that he was planning on producing them. He has been known to pirate images, misrepresent "fantasy" images as rare, and even fabricate false histories, to justify his work. Its just my opinion, that his approach to his self promoting is, well, in a word, Cheesy. He has his own agenda to stir up trouble, and rally his followers, to speak for him, rather than speak for himself.

I just had to entertain myself. I took a look at Duane Bucks site. Sure enough, he posted MY PICTURE, of MY Far-Go sign, WITHOUT my permission. Class act Duane! You should be proud of yourself!

Following is the only comment I will make on this thread:

Just to make the record straight, I was asked to work on an AA Vickers image for a future globe lens. Once I had it in the rough and sent it out to my customers for their approval, I received an e-mail from a Colorado collector with the two Far-go images attached to the e-mail asking if I thought these images could be produced. I answered that I didn't think so because I thought they were too plain, but I would ask my customers if anyone was interested. One responded "yes" and seven responded "no." So I have no plan of producing these images and will remove them from my website.

"Class Act":
My version of a "class act": A collector saves his money all year to go to Iowa Gas as he hears it's the best show going. He visits with a lot of friends, meets a lot of new friends, and goes to the Bash only to find four guys wearing and passing out hate buttons with his name on it. Now that's a "Class Act" for you!

Just please answer a VERY important question. What gives you, Dwaine Buck, the right, to post MY picture, of My sign, on your website, as your work? Thats MY picture! You stole it, and posted it on your site! WHAT gives you the right?

Welcome to Oldgas, the finest most mature site on the web! LOL

Leave it alone !!!, It's really between two individuals !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Each party has had their say in this. This is a dispute between these people, so we expect it to be worked out privately or through attorneys, not aired out here on this forum.

The use of images without permission is an ongoing problem. There are legal ownership and copyright issues that are best discussed with a knowledgeable intellectual property attorney. Images posted on Oldgas.com Shop Talk are protected by copyright on behalf of the image owner. Members do give Primarily Petroliana permission to display the image on the Web.

The moderators expect that all registered and unregistered users respect the ownership rights to any images posted here.

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Jim "Oldgas" Potts
Your host and moderator

Please settle/discuss this privately outside of oldgas.

Thunder's image is not the only one.

As far as Fairlanes comment..... Its a fact that my pic was stolen, and posted on Dwaine Bucks site, as his work! So what gives him the right? Crickets. How can you deny that those actions are theivery? Still waiting for an answer Dwaine.....

I've had a question about the comment I made about the "Bearcat" images. To clarify that, the original image, is not perfectly oval shaped. I was also hoping to have it made as a water transfer decal, not a vinyl decal. However, the current decal was nicely done. Good work Koz.

I have to take this opportunity to thank Jeff Cerami (Thunder) for having the great luck of discovering the Bearcat decal under layers of paint on a 36B door panel. Without HIM the Bearcat Globe would not be today!

I hope to have a Far-Go globe as well.

Hope ya' have many more finds!

Larry

A Question for thunder:
It's pretty well known by anybody that frequents Oldgas that you don't like Dwaine Buck, but I was wondering if you could comment on the last part of his post in this thread.

Here is Dwaine's quote:

"Class Act":
"My version of a "class act": A collector saves his money all year to go to Iowa Gas as he hears it's the best show going. He visits with a lot of friends, meets a lot of new friends, and goes to the Bash only to find four guys wearing and passing out hate buttons with his name on it. Now that's a "Class Act" for you!"

I am awaiting the response of someone who says he speaks the truth.... Ahem.
bob

Sorry but I cant refrain from putting in my 2 cents here, first of all what makes you think that it was Buck that pirated your pictures ? he says they were sent to him via email from another COLORADO collector...maybe you should focus your witch hunt there ? I went through a similar fiasco on this site with a Gardner decal that I found and it was pirated by several people ! it ended up getting reproduced by several people with my permission but it would have anyway with or without it ! my point is if you dont want it to happen then dont put it out there in public domain ! keep it private or put "sample" across it ! simple as that ! I said I wouldn't get involved in a **** match on this or any site but this post just rubs me wrong ! if what Buck says and Husky Bob says above is true about Iowa gas and the buttons then I can only say that i'm glad NOT to know you ! cause I guarantee you wouldn't like where I put those buttons ! Z

Edit to remove unacceptable language

[This message has been edited by Oldgas (edited 02-16-2008).]

H1HUMMER:

First post, (under a new name) and you received a STRIKE!

That's a record here on OLDGAS, It can't be broken. I mean can it guys ?

Huskybob...... My friends and members of my family, have fought and died, in wars around this world, to defend the rights and freedoms, that we have in this great nation of ours. One of those rights is "Freedom of Speech". I, can wear, whatever button, that I choose to wear. The Contitution, of the United Staes of America, allows me , that right. Ahem.

H1Hummer...... If you LOOKED at Bucks site, BEFORE he romoved my photo, you would have seen MY picture there. In fact, as Dwaine posted "I have no plan of producing these images and will remove them from my website." Thats an admission that he did indeed, post MY picture...... So before you buy into the hate campaign, that Dwaine Buck, has started against me, I suggest that you do a little reasearch, and find the facts, not the lies.....

Now, simply stated, I have answered, to the hate comments here, but has anybody noticed, that Dwaine Buck, doesn't have the integrity, to answer a simple question, put to him? So the question still stands..... Dwaine, what gives you the right, to post my picture, on your website, as your work?

The key issue here is that the image was used without permission. If I take a TV from your house and give it to somebody else, it is still stolen property. Wouldn't most people ask, "Where'd the TV come from?" It seems not so with content on the Internet. It is so easy to grab images and use them, some people think it is OK. Images are the property of someone just like the TV. Permission should always be asked for and received before it is used.

The use of images without permission has hurt the hobby. Serious collectors of original globes and signs are now less willing to share their items by posting pictures here and elsewhere online.

It is also not acceptable to wage a grudge campaign to hurt other people like the incidents at Iowa Gas that were mentioned.

Why can't we all respect other people and their property?


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Jim "Oldgas" Potts
Your host and moderator

Probably is a record BTG ? (sorry Jim) I'm not buying into any hate campaign....all I was saying Thunder is that how do know that DB pirated your picture ? because it was posted on his site ? someone else could have pirated it (even me) and sent it to him like he says, I personally have sent him many images for possible recreation... but you flat out accuse him of stealing it on a public domain forum ? whatever is between you two should remain between you and him (privately) and we should not have to be subjected to it ! as you say.....freedom of speech....just remember it's a two way street. I have no beef with you or anyone else here but it seems to me that you are the one throwing the darts before all the facts are in ? as far as the button goes.....well sure you have the right but it doesn't show much class nor should it be endorsed by anyone in this hobby ! I agree with Jim, why cant we all just play nice ? I save my energy for the "buggers" (is that word ok Jim ?) that are selling the repop signs on feebay as originals !

Hummer..... I've got NO PROBLEM with ANYTHING, that ANYBODY has to say about me. AS LONG AS THEY SPEAK THE TRUTH. If you weren't there, you dont know what I wore. If you heard Dwaines story, I can assure you that its a LIE. As far as the picture, it was posted here, for the C.O.T.M. feature. How can anybody deny that? Besides that, are you the voice of Dwaine Buck? This is NOT about me, exercising my right, to Freedom of Speech. Its abouth theft, and a huge lack of integrity. My issue is not WHAT dwaine Buck does. We would never have, a lot of the wonderful products that we have, without the reproduction people. My issue is HOW Dwiane Buck chooses to operate.


With that said..... The question STILL stands. Dwaine? Its your floor. Please tell us, what gives you the right, to post my picture, as your work?

I appologize for not capatalizing Dwaines name in the previous post. I chose to repost, with the correction, instead of editing.

Is the button "story" true or false?

Just wondering, Ryan

This BS is getting very old! Thunder, what gives you the right to lay claim to anything made by someone else 60-70 years ago. That person is the ONLY one that has the rights! There has been way too much of the laying claim and copyrighting of images in this hobby(not just you). They are a part of history and everyone has a right to see and enjoy someone elses work from the past. Not just the few that claimed it as theirs. This is the **** that destroys it for others and does nothing to promote this as a hobby!

Thunder wrote:

"Here is a copy on an e-mail, that I recently recieved.....
Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 367
Location: Dwaine Buck, Big Valley, California
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 7:18 am Post subject:

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Good Morning to you. Been working on some globe art, Fargo oil Co, from Colorado.
Glad your feeling better Cheese.
_________________"

Now tell the truth Thunder, where did you copy and paste that from? I know where it came from. Or did someone copy and paste it and send it to you? Can't realy tell for sure, but it was copied from the Pit Stop. Did anyone get permission from Cheese? Just saying.


Not adding gas to the fire, just showing it goes both ways.


Have fun.


BL

Ryan..... I'm seem to remember meeting you at IG. The button, in question, didn't seem to cocern you then.....

Gary.... I'm not laying claim, to the rights to the Far-Go images. In fact, as I stated in "For Sale" forum, that "I'll have details available, as soon as I can make all the legal arrangements made for reproduction"


Brian...... Of course it came from the "Pit Stop Forum". Its not being claimed as my own work, as Dwaine chose to do with my picture. ......

It just amazes me how so many people, allow Dwaine Buck, to operate the way he does, then jump to his defense. It must be because he cannot answer for his own actions.

The question still stands, and its only for Dwaine Buck to answer.... Dwaine, what gives you the right, to post my picture, on your website, as your own work?

I am neutral here, this is a private dispute....

I believe this happens alot & there is a fine line between the law, respect, etiquette ,grudges, promotion of the hobby...etc.....

I love Globe Image Album however with all due respect i am sure it would be near impossibile to get every "current" globe owners permission to use all those different photos..I think what they have done is great for the hobby & only prmotes it.....

I believe there are programs out there that will allow you to protect your images from being copied.......I know you can protect them on ebay (thru Blackthorne}...i use this feature myself..........

i remember this guy i had seen for years taking photos of peoples merch at Chicago Coin -Op & one show he walked right into my booth & started taking photos of some of my signs........I politely asked him if should'nt ask permission & he went off on this tirade about how i am in a public place & he can take as many as he pleases, without my permission........Needless to say i wanted to punch him right in the teeth however i treated him with respect......at the last show 2007 approx. 8 years later, here comes this guy with all his camera gear & steps into my booth to take photos, however this time he spent approx. $500 on a sign before he left...........



[This message has been edited by roadrelics@aol.com (edited 02-16-2008).]

Does it matter who took the image and passed it along? Does the knowledge make it any less wrong? Imagine you have a rare globe, sign, etc. and you share it with this site. You spent a lot of time and money aquiring this special item and then someone takes the image and calls it theirs. You wouldn't be mad, want to rip someones head off? I like to see these great looking collections and I bet you all do too. If the people who have been kind enough to share here can't trust that they and their items will be treated respectfully and not stolen then kiss BOTW, FATW and other segments on this site goodbye. Why would anyone take the chance that their items wouldn't be pirated? Any personal conflicts are just that... personal and the people involved don't have to answer to anyone but themselves. I will get off my soapbox now before I fall on my ....
Roadrelics and I have had our diferences but what he says sounds real good to me. We all should be helping protect our hobby not tearing it apart.

[This message has been edited by Bob Richards (edited 02-16-2008).]

As I stated earlier, and please allow me to paraphrase, I appreciate the work that Dwaine Buck, and others who reproduce images, artwork, and/or parts. Without these people, we would not have a lot of the cool stuff that we have today. The "Bearcat" image is a prime example of what I speak of. I hope that I made my point, in that I took offense to my picture, being posted on Dwaines website, as his own work.

I also find it sad, how so many people, replied, without ever addressing the issue that I brought up, theft and piracy.

I think that Bob Richards said it pretty well.

I'm getting off my soapbox too. Thanks Bob.