Oldgas.com Home
Posted By: Bob Richards Another fraud making unmarked signs - Thu Feb 13 2014 04:40 PM
Maybe this Seller has been noted before? If not;Their Ebay name is "passion4signs" and also sell under "classiccarsnsigns"...

One of their "made to order signs"

http://www.ebay.com/itm/AC-DELCO-SPARKPL...VE/231157152211
Posted By: cdreed06 Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Feb 14 2014 01:08 PM
They aren't stating that it is an original.
Posted By: Bob Richards Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Feb 14 2014 06:41 PM
WHAT PART OF "NOT MARKING", DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?

When a fake is NOT, marked as such. It can be sold "down the line" as an original... When marked, the "Seller" has to alter the item to remove or obscure the markings....

WE ARE COLLECTORS HERE; For the most part... It hurts our hobby, when frauds make and sell repops and fantasy items as originals!!!!! Or when others, sell repops and fantasy items at "Gas and Oil" Shows, Flea Markets, in Auctions... etc... When they know that the items are "Unmarked" Fakes....
Posted By: JeffS Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Feb 14 2014 07:17 PM
It's clear that the seller is making the signs to order. Calling him a "fraud" is extreme and incorrect in this situation.
Posted By: Steven C. Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Feb 14 2014 07:29 PM
It's about the downstream guy!! Not the person buying this piece today. It's about the preservation of the authentic. Unmarked/undated fantasy/repop pieces pervert the future of the hobby.
Get it??
Posted By: Bob Richards Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Feb 14 2014 07:45 PM
Jeff, are you a Collector, a Decorator, a "Picker" or...?

I am a Collector. Been one for multiple decades...

In my opinion, I am 100% correct...

I believe that most Collectors feel the same about those that make "Unmarked" items; Items that can be passed off as originals by future Sellers; Because the items have no markings showing that they are not old nor original...
Posted By: JimT Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Feb 14 2014 09:01 PM
Originally Posted By: JeffS
It's clear that the seller is making the signs to order. Calling him a "fraud" is extreme and incorrect in this situation.
He's making limited unmarked reproduction items for a profit. What would the proper name or term be?
Posted By: JeffS Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Feb 14 2014 09:48 PM
fraud [frawd]
noun

deceit, trickery, sharp practice, or breach of confidence, perpetrated for profit or to gain some unfair or dishonest advantage.

- Bottom line, this seller is doing nothing deceitful. He CLEARLY states that the signs are made to order. Anyone that takes one of his signs and pawns it off as original would be the fraud.
Posted By: JeffS Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Feb 14 2014 10:07 PM
Originally Posted By: Steve C.
It's about the downstream guy!! Not the person buying this piece today. It's about the preservation of the authentic. Unmarked/undated fantasy/repop pieces pervert the future of the hobby.
Get it??


Yes, I "get" your comment. My point is that the seller is in no way being fraudulent, as the OP stated in the title of this thread. The potential fraud would be downstream.
Posted By: Steven C. Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Feb 14 2014 10:42 PM
The use of the word "fraud" could in fact be debated here. I can give you that.
But I still find it disrespectful to the hobby to produce unmarked/undated pieces. If you believe in preserving history and authenticity, there is never an excuse for that practice.
Posted By: roadrelics Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Feb 14 2014 11:37 PM
i wonder if he paying royalties on the rights to use all these different logos....If he does one of H-D , they may be at his door soon....not sure if its illegal, but he could be held accountable in civil court.....
Posted By: JeffS Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Sun Feb 16 2014 05:23 PM
I totally agree that the duplication of these signs could be illegal, depending on copyright laws.
Posted By: Dave's Garage Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Tue Mar 11 2014 02:52 PM
Fraud is a deception deliberately practiced in order to secure unfair or unlawful gain.

Vintage style sign is not as clear as metal sign with vinyl graphics applied. Selling copyright protected/intellectual property without a proper licensing agreement in place isn't exactly stellar or lawful behavior.

The guy is an opportunist with no regard for the hobby, purchaser or anyone else. It's all about money...greed. In my books he is a crook, fraudster amongst many other things. Definitely not someone I would be defending. I'm with Bob.
Posted By: Keystone Gas Man Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Tue Mar 11 2014 04:38 PM
Just date the darn things!!
Posted By: Catauladave Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Wed Mar 12 2014 02:04 AM
How does anyone know that these signs are not dated or marked ? It would actually be to the manufacturers best interest to do to encourage repeat business. I did not see any close-up photos or evidence to suggest that they were or were not. Dave
Posted By: Bob Richards Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Wed Mar 12 2014 04:04 PM
Dave, I contacted the Seller.... Before I started the thread...
Posted By: Maxgas Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Sat Mar 15 2014 10:13 AM
Looser, selling JUNK!
Posted By: rd_signs Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Mon May 05 2014 08:59 PM
And some of the repops do have dates as original, Texaco, Pure, and Shamrock, come to mind. Some even have the original sign company name,right in the porcelain as original..Do Not tell me that is NOT intent to deceive.
Posted By: Standard Gas&Oil Re: Another fraud making unmarked signs - Fri Jul 25 2014 12:43 AM
These guys are notorious "Shill bidders" check out the bidding history from others before you buy one their fake signs.
© Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk