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#17798 - Thu Aug 16 2007 09:12 AM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
dodogas Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Sat Jan 25 2003
Loc: Kelowna British Columbia Canad...
BBQ Chicken, are you not glad to live in a country where you can reproduce something IF you want to???

Now how you present that product is the crux of the issue..

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Please use For Sale forums to sell

Please - NO offers to Buy or Sell in this forum category

Statements such as, "I'm thinking about selling this." are considered an offer to sell.
#17799 - Thu Aug 16 2007 09:22 AM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
Gary Drye Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Fri Oct 13 2000
Loc: Clarksville, Tn. USA
Thanks Bill, I finally got the third one to show. "Shell Green Streak Sign" only has 2 results, but just "Green Streak" got me there. And you are correct. Thanks again.

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#17800 - Thu Aug 16 2007 09:41 AM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
marxmobilgas Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Thu Jul 10 2003
Loc: DFW Texas USA
BBQ Chicken
I see what you are saying but the repro vendors on this site would never try to pass off what they are selling as authentic. That's the difference.
I'd rather have the real item just like anyone but I can't afford the $500 sign or find one in good shape.
Without repro's every old car, juke box, coke machine, gas pump, vending machine, barber pole, pedal car, payphone, motorcycle, advertising clock, or any other piece of Americana that wasnt in decent shape would have to be trashed. Why keep if you cant restore?

Now they are a problem with collectors. And as time goes on and these repros "naturally" age (as opposed to the sped up aging in Argentina)they will be harder and harder to detect. People will lose the catalogs and other current literature on these items.
It's a double edged sword that is unfortunately reality.

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#17801 - Thu Aug 16 2007 11:07 AM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
Alex Offline
Moderator, Value Forum

Registered: Mon Dec 08 2003
Loc: Butte, Montana USA
BBQ Chicken. I agree with you to the extent that repros are bad if passed off as original. I redid a Benet pump in Texaco Silver and put my original Texaco Ethyl globe on it. But, try to find an original decal that was used to brand the pump. First of all, it would be so old it wouldn't work. Secondly, I wouldn't want to use it and would rather save it as an artifact. I am gong to have a decal made that is magnetic. It will look ok, but not original. I am even Ok with reproduction globes, as long as it is known or they are marked. I would love to do a Signal pump, but can't afford an original globe. I respect your opinion and your right to state it, but I think you are being "too pure."
_________________________
Alex
Looking for Texaco and Power Gasoline items

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#17802 - Thu Aug 16 2007 01:29 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
BBQ Chicken Offline
Petro Enthusiast

Registered: Sun Oct 02 2005
Loc: Raleigh, NC
You just can't have it both ways....... you can't. There is no way to make it ok one way, and wrong another way. No double standard. Whether the guy lied to you before you bought it, whether you got it on a website, it was dated, bought it as a repro, no matter how you want to slice it or hold it up to the light, it's still a reproduction. "Limited edition", dated, all that, who cares, it doesn't change it or catergorize it to be alright now. It's still fake and not real or acceptable. It's wrong from it's conception and production. They have and hold no value, except for the new guy or impulse buyer that has no idea about the situation that he/she is getting into. They aren't worth the material they are printed on. An analogy would be if you went to an opera or a fine show and had really good seats, and in strolls this loud, late arriving, audience member with a horrible cold; sits down, gets out some crinkly bag of cough drops, hankerchiefs, starts coughing, sneezing, blowing his nose, eating, slurping on a drink, talking to the people around him , just a total pain in the rear. A distraction - a MAJOR troublesome distraction. You payed your good hard earned money to a show that may never come to your home town again, and some clown doesn't respect the venue, the actual show itself, or the patrons that have come to se the show. Just garbage. Ruining the whole true pure experience for everyone else. Just a big headache distraction. That's what repros are. And they are like a really good Mexican meal, they don't burn you just once - they burn you three times!.!.!.!.!. when you eat it, when you pay for it, and when you go to get rid of it the next day!!!

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#17803 - Thu Aug 16 2007 03:12 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
Alex Offline
Moderator, Value Forum

Registered: Mon Dec 08 2003
Loc: Butte, Montana USA
No one is asking to have it "both ways." And your opera analogy makes no sense to the discussion. (At least to me) Repros have a valid purpose. Faceplates ona pump are a good example. There are not enough good originals out there to fill the need for restored pumps. There are not enough original globes to fill the need. I prefer and want originals. but, they just are not there or are too $$$. Passing off repros for originals is bad, I think we all agree on that. The Bennet pump I restored had two panels that were shot. i replaced it with new sheet metal. Are you saying that makes it worth less than all original. I think not. What was the option, send it to the dump?? I think not. I agree that all original is the best. But, if you dent your fender and have to replace it with an after market fender, are you telling me your car is worth less?
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Alex
Looking for Texaco and Power Gasoline items

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#17804 - Thu Aug 16 2007 03:38 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
Pablo Offline
Petro Enthusiast

Registered: Thu Jan 13 2005
Loc: El Dorado Hills, CA
BBQ-
Sounds like you have your narrow mind made up that repops are totally wrong. I agree with others on the board that they have their place in the hobby. I don't collect them myself but "db" notes that many restorations would be impossible without repops. Most of us in the hobby are already familiar with the repop and fantasy signs produced by the usual nostalgia vendors so there is no real confusion.

The main problem is the undated repops made like the originals to fool collectors or, even worse, the fake dated versions (i.e., "1933" Texaco No Smoking sign, etc). Keep in mind, any legal action in the USA to require dating on reproductions would have no impact on foreign manufacturers. As we know, the foreign repops are evolving into the biggest problem today. Some of the these foreign made porcelain signs have thick porcelain with heavy shelving. If these guys ever get the colors and backs right, we're all in trouble!!

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#17805 - Thu Aug 16 2007 03:48 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
Bob Richards Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Tue Feb 22 2005
Loc: Longview, WA
The subject of marked and unmarked reproductions is a serious and emotional thorn to all who collect. That being said, without reproduction items how many "treasures" would still be available for the "masses"? There would be few if any collector cars older than the 1980 models. For any part manufactured after a model year has run, is a reproduction item. May use the same dies, but are reproduction items. It is the same with our hobby, like Dick said, decals are used. That decal is a reproduction item. As long as an item is marked as a reproduction it has a place in our hobby, my opinion. If this idea has no place, then only an extreme few will be able to enjoy our hobby. Museums and high dollar collectors will be the only ones to have money enough to own a true "original" item. If we draw a line against reproductions, then do we draw that same line against restorations? In both cases the "original" has been altered. The purist will always "balk" at anything not original. But how many of us really consider ourselves a "purist"? We enjoy a hobby that has gained momentum by leaps and bounds and prices reflect that. With these rising prices, more of the "shadow" people, those who prey on those that collect will emerge with reproduction items. As prices skyrocket, reproduction items will get better and better. It is the same with other forms of collecting whether it is cars, paintings or antique furniture. We must do what we have been doing, looking out for each other and reporting items as we find them. I get more knowledge when someone questions an original item and those with the knowledge tell us all how we can tell the differences. At times it it is easy to lose sight of what we are trying to do, enjoying our hobby the way we want to. Each of us is different and collect for a hundred( maybe more) different reasons. But whether a collector has one item or 100 warehouses full of items, we all are the same. A collector of "gas and oil items". Hopefully we won't lose sight of that in our discussions. I know I have, on more than one occasion. Just the ramblings of a middle aged man. LOL
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Looking for Tide Water/ Tide Water-Associated/ Tidewater items

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#17806 - Thu Aug 16 2007 04:10 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
Pablo Offline
Petro Enthusiast

Registered: Thu Jan 13 2005
Loc: El Dorado Hills, CA
Somebody just retracted their bid on one of the genuine Green Streak signs and it's now way back below reserve. I guess this thread may have scared him off??

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#17807 - Thu Aug 16 2007 04:37 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
souperhigh Offline
Petro Enthusiast

Registered: Thu Feb 23 2006
Loc: Tulsa,Oklahoma United States ...
I FEEL THERE IS A PLACE FOR REPRODUCTIONS IF THEY ARE DATED OR DESIGNATED SOMEWAY THAT THEY ARE REPRODUCTIONS.
BUT PERSONALLY BEING A CAN AND GLOBE COLLECTOR, I AM VERY GLAD THE WE HAVE GUYS LIKE DARRYL AT ROADRELICS, TOM AT TOMZCOLLECTIBLEZ, PABLO AND RAY (HOTCIDR) THAT MAKE A LIVING OR FULL TIME SIGN COLLECTORS ON THIS SITE.THEIR KNOWLEDGE AND HELP CAN AND DOES SAVE US ALOT OF MONEY AND MISERY.
BUT WE HAVE SOME FINE VENDORS HERE THAT SERVE A GREAT NEED FOR THOSE WHO NEED REPRODUCTION FOR ANY REASON.WHO ARE HONEST AND QUICK TO LET US KNOW IF REAL OR NOT.
SO AS MEMBERS HERE WE HAVE THE BEST OF BOTH WORLDS.
AND THANKS MOBIL100 FOR LETTING US KNOW ABOUT THIS GUY SELLING REPOPS AND DESCRIBING THEM AS ORIGIONALS.

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#17808 - Thu Aug 16 2007 05:54 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
BBQ Chicken Offline
Petro Enthusiast

Registered: Sun Oct 02 2005
Loc: Raleigh, NC
Ok, then if you say originals are too high$$$, why is that??? And repros are dirt cheap$$$, why is that??? There is your analogy right there. In a nut shell. People have to understand this, and I hope that all of you will listen and think about this; not every person that "collects" is supposed to own a Polly globe..... not everyone that collects is supposed to own a Texaco one piece globe.... not everyone that collects is supposed to own a twin clockface pump....... not everyone is supposed to drive a $65,000 car....... that is not reality(to recall a previous members post). Reality is that not everyone is supposed to have what they want all the time, and if they can't afford it, make some cheap **** to contaminate the rest of what's going on. Simple. Just admire the real beauty and authenticity(THE TRUE POWER) of the originals, and you won't long for these pieces of garbage. There is a power there - and if you really are a true collector and a hunter of this magnificent treasure from an extrememly significant period of time, you know the power that I am speaking of. It has a way, a way of enveloping your soul and transforming you to a different time and place. I know this site is trying to "clean up" a little and stear clear of personal attacks, but to recall a previous members post, where I was referred to as having a "narrow mind" , I sit and wonder if it is not truly the opposite...... I wonder if the expansion and education of some minds is very limited to say the least. But I don't hold anyone accountable, after all we are all animals any way.......

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#17809 - Thu Aug 16 2007 07:24 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
Dick Bennett Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Wed Oct 25 2000
Loc: Santa Paula, Calif
IF I go to an OPERA, MOVIE THEATER or CONCERT I'd have to be SICK !
db

[This message has been edited by Dick Bennett (edited 08-16-2007).]
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Reproduction/Fantasy Cans
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p2/oldegaspump/AllCansMASTERTHUMBNAIL_zps4bfdbbc7.jpg
Rnd Can Re-lids


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#17810 - Thu Aug 16 2007 07:31 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
hotcidr Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Fri Jul 27 2001
Loc: Carpinteria, Ca. USA
I totally agree that reproduction pieces have there place in our hobby and 95% of you also agree. There is nothing wrong with selling reproductions but take a look at this guys ebay ad and tell me he's not a crook. That said I have just reported Canyshop to ebay for false advertising and have sent him the following:

First of all I've just reported you to ebay as selliing your reproduction signs and trying to pass them off as old. We, a very large group of collectors, are going to hire a lawyer and you will be stopped from your false advertising.
Now shut up or put up..it's time we did stop this guy.

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#17811 - Thu Aug 16 2007 07:33 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
T-way Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Wed Jul 24 2002
Loc: Riley, MI, USA
Your reality, Sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever!
-- Baron Munchausen
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#17812 - Thu Aug 16 2007 08:12 PM Re: Check out the fakes this guy sells
Jarvis Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Wed Nov 01 2000
Loc: Evansville, In
Here is a question. What if you sold a $1000 original sign and some guy gives you fake $100 bills... he can go to jail! If you give him $1000 of original $100 bills for a faked unmarked sign you have what?

What if people started making unmarked fake money how long would that last?
_________________________
Looking for anything from Hoosier Pete, Platolene 500 and Red Bird.

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