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Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22573
Wed Jan 11 2006 07:20 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 07:20 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 129
Reseda CA USA
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tall49guy Offline
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tall49guy  Offline
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Reseda CA USA
In the end, if it involves control over producing items for sale, its about economics (money). Items that were in the public domain for sooo long should be left there. Others don't see it that way as there are "investments" involved, thus investments to protect. Limiting items almost always has the effect of driving prices up. Scarcity creates value to the beholder or to the person or person(s) who stand to reap the benefits of the scarcity. In my opinion, trends in the hobby that benefit as many as possible are desirable. Those trends or changes that do not benefit the majority in this hobby are less desirable. Hopefully the trends that are not beneficial to the majority will be few in number and weak.


Dave Folck
Please use For Sale forums to sell

Please - NO offers to Buy or Sell in this forum category

Statements such as, "I'm thinking about selling this." are considered an offer to sell.
Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22574
Wed Jan 11 2006 07:54 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 07:54 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,780
Santa Paula, Calif
Dick Bennett Offline
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Dick Bennett  Offline
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Posts: 22,780
Santa Paula, Calif
I've got a photo of the BLACK FRYE DROP globe in question BEFORE Sam bought it.

I received a photo of the BEARCAT, BEFORE the current onwner saw the door it is on.

I also took a picture of the pump with the PDQ decal BEFORE the person that sold it to Seth owned it [It's differant than the Globe]. I posted the PDQ globe picture on this site [FOR ALL TO ENJOY].

I posted a photo of my MOTOPOWER GASOLINE sign [only one known], that is pictured on a website that has plans for a future globe.

HARLEY NEVER did lic. their logo for the globes that were made, BUT they did TELL the maker to stop or GO TO COURT.

IF, you want to repoduce a globe or image for YOURSELF, nobody is going to haul you into court. BUT, if you repoduce a COPYRIGHT image to SELL or MASS PRODUCE, then you are LOOKING FOR TROUBLE.

Dick Bennett

[This message has been edited by Dick Bennett (edited 01-11-2006).]

Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22575
Wed Jan 11 2006 08:04 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 08:04 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,752
Edgewater, Colorful Colorado
st.rod Offline
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st.rod  Offline
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Posts: 2,752
Edgewater, Colorful Colorado
If the LAW allows you or anyone to apply for copyright on an item and the owner has not, or has let it expire. XIN LOI If you and yours don't like the laws, ( And I don't always ) go about changing them or Shut The Front Door


Anyone got another post to talk about


In memory of DB 9/12/49 - 8/28/14
Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22576
Wed Jan 11 2006 08:14 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 08:14 PM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,229
Interlaken, NY
5
59fairlane Offline
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59fairlane  Offline
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Interlaken, NY
WOW.....

Just spent a "litle" time reading through these posts. I'll say it again, WOW........

What the hey, I spent all that time reading, I'll add my two cents.

This had happened in other hobby areas. I am a diverse collector, Gas, Oil, Cars, Bottles, Soda, Antiques, Trains, Firearms, Decoys, you name it. I actually do some writing for a small soda pop magazine. I am also somewhat young, 36 with two young daughters, so my wallet is extremely limited and often empty.

I have one original globe (Mobil Special) that my dad gave me for Christmas one year that he actually traded a guy work (house painting) in order to get this globe for me. That globe will never leave my possession at any time. Common globe, not worth a ton, but to me.....priceless. That's what hobbies and collecting are all about.

When something you enjoy starts to get and feel like work, then it's no fun. The hobby is ruined for you.

Someone had a post about tearing apart a man's globe to see if it is a repo. Excellent point. Look at the classic car hobby for instance. This is where this will head, I see it at auctions all the time. Buyer beware.

I buy stuff because it strikes a passion within. Sometimes all I can do is admire other peoples stuff because I can't afford or find stuff like they have. That's cool. That's why I love this site and others like it. I hope it doesn't change.

There will always be people that are in it for the money and not the love of it. Those people are easy to pick out and I just won't buy from them no matter what. What's the point.

Great posts, great topic, don't let a few bad apples ruin it for everyone else.

Have a good night, God Bless.


Always looking for Ithaca Gun and Lucky Sam soda items!!!


Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22577
Wed Jan 11 2006 08:18 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 08:18 PM
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,911
Guthrie, OK. 73044
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Seth Robbins Offline
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Seth Robbins  Offline
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Guthrie, OK. 73044
Thanks 59....I for one think that is a good place to leave things.

[This message has been edited by Seth Robbins (edited 01-11-2006).]

Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22578
Wed Jan 11 2006 08:49 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 08:49 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 468
Wisconsin
A
Aaron S. Offline
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Aaron S.  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 468
Wisconsin
Wow seems like this has turned in to more of a witch hunt than anything. Who are we to make judgements on other people motives. Really why does everyone care where he got the pictures? If anything it should be between Roger and anyone who has the glode or pictures of it and Tway, Not everyone who just feels like pickin sides and arguing. Everyone says dont let it go to the lawyers but its seems as if well have some ameture lawyers presenting a case trying to get other members to become the trial jury. There has already been a motion to suspend Tway from the site, i mean come on now. This is getting out of hand. Then people are saying they are afraid to post there pictures cause they are afraid that they will be stolen to make reproductions I guess if u feel that way then dont post your stuff, but that in it self hurts the hobby by not sharing info with other hobbyist. I personally think that rare globes need to be reproduced for the people that are in the hobby that love the old nostalgic look that cant afford to spend 5 grand on a single globe. The whole part about doing them as a limited run to drive there profits is a bunch of pooh. Things cost more to produce in smaller numbers hence the price goes up. a limited edition isnt an original but it give the buyer the personal satisfaction of knowing that he has something special that not everyone has. so whats wrong with running lense in lower numbers... for example lense from an west coast oil company may not be desirable to a collector on the east coast. So why print a million of one type of lense when odds are only a half a million people will buy it. Just like every thing else if it sells out then odds are there will be a second run.

To get back on track here I guess the thing that bothers me the most about this is the fact that It was said that people like this are killing the hobby, but the way i see it people like this are just providing affordable history to collectors that just plain enjoy the hobby and cant spend every dollar on it. The people that are infact hurting the hobby are those who spend crazy amounts of money and buy up every thing insight making items seem more rare and driving the market on stuff up. If there werent repo's done of these the hobby would be dominated by the rich. Dont get me wrong i would take an original over a repo any day. Some of the prices things go for and just plain the fact that there arent any more out there sometimes reproductions are the only way to go for the little guy. The comment about speaking with the wallet says alot about the hobby and where its heading already. This mind set is totally wrong and trying to sway others judgement on this matter isnt right. About the bearcat decal, do what u want get it pattended yourself if u dont want someone else to do it. You may have the only one posted on here but it doesnt mean its the only one out there and if some one pat. it to get it put out there for others to enjoy and makes a little money in the prossess who cares thats buisness its been goin on for hundreds of years. So if u want to keep it to your self the file for the pattend and if u dont the as they say " you snooze, you lose". Plus any way wut is all the talk about this anyway noone has repoped any yet so this all seems like a big what if. And if it happens and it is done in an illeagal manner deal with it then.

Wow that is the most ive typed in years! lol
probally alot of typos in there but oh well i never claimed to be a grammer teacher. Any way that is it for now. So dont anyone get mad at me for giving my opinions because thats what they are is "opinions".

Any way I hope this gets resolved before the site gets devide if half.

Thanks Aaron


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Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22579
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:04 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:04 PM
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 446
hamilton
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gasgeezer Online content
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gasgeezer  Online Content
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 446
hamilton
Whew! I feel like im in the 10th round of a title fight! Im just going to say, and i know a lot of you feel the same. I have some neat 1 of a kind items in my collection and know of lots of others around also. I quit sending in pics to old gas a long time ago because another fellow asked (and i thankfully declined) to repop a super rare lens i own.He mentioned that with the phot he had he could do it anyway but He was gratious enough not to do it and i thank him for that.He will know who he is! Thanx! Its this mentality that just because you have the laws in your favor, you can walk all over another person. That just "dont make it right". Search your own soul to see how you would want to be treated.

Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22580
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:16 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:16 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 746
Longmont, CO
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RARIN TO GO Offline
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RARIN TO GO  Offline
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Longmont, CO
"About the bearcat decal, do what u want get it pattended yourself if u dont want someone else to do it."
I think the issue with the Powerine/Bearcat image is that me and many other Colorado collectors do NOT WANT IT COPYRIGHTED AT ALL!!! It is a wonderful logo and one that I and others feel should remain for others to use and even profit from if they want. I would just not want them to "copyright" it. I hear there IS a Bearcat image in the making and as much as I said wanted one when Thunder posted the pics and it was mentioned that a repo could be made I will not buy one that is copyrighted. I think the Speedway globe from colorado has already been copyrighted. I just want others to be able to use it as they have been free to do for decades without fear of being sued.
A limited run of 30 non-copyrighted globes will sell just as well and make someone just as much money and ensure that others can enjoy and even profit from it in the future.
It's an ethics thing for me. Just because it's legal don't make it right in my book.
Chris

[This message has been edited by RARIN TO GO (edited 01-11-2006).]

Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22581
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:20 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:20 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,240
Decatur, IL
thermactor Offline
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thermactor  Offline
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Decatur, IL
If I had enough spare money lying around, I'd copyright images like the bearcat, and just not enforce it. I'd just let anyone use it as they pleased - that would be the true way to ensure that it always stays free.

Wes

Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22582
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:21 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:21 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 796
Parker, CO USA
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scootdog Offline
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Parker, CO USA
Well a few glasses of wine and I am now much happier.

All the new repo globes that are available is an asset to the hobby. I own one and even though the colors are wrong I still like it. My problem starts when the artist now controls all future products with that logo that he never thought of. He was just a duplicator and now he gets to have the say so and a percent of each item sold with that artwork? I am not sure who said the comment about there not being money in these items and I kinda agree. As far as a business goes this is not a high growth industry. So if not for profit why do it at all? Ego? I don't have the answer but I do have my opinion about the ramifications of this behavior. Ask your self this, why have pogo or slama not been brought into this conversation?

I don't dislike tway. I have never met the guy. I don't like his copied artwork and the copyright process that he is using not to protect his investment but to control this hobby.


Scott
Wanted- Powerine and Powerlube items!
Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22583
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:25 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:25 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,780
Santa Paula, Calif
Dick Bennett Offline
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Dick Bennett  Offline
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Santa Paula, Calif
Lets hear the OTHER side of the STORY.
WASN'T it a 3-SOME PARTNERSHIP ?
db

Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22584
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:26 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:26 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 746
Longmont, CO
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RARIN TO GO Offline
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RARIN TO GO  Offline
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Longmont, CO
I'd do the same Wes. But would rather leave thing be.

Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22585
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:35 PM
Wed Jan 11 2006 09:35 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 796
Parker, CO USA
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scootdog Offline
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scootdog  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 796
Parker, CO USA
dick- lets not go there. I think they are still involved in the suit and they have made there choice to handle it it court.

If I am not beaten to the punch the bearcat globe will be made and sold for COST. No artist fees as I will be picking that up and then the artwork shared with anyone who wants it.


Scott
Wanted- Powerine and Powerlube items!
Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22586
Thu Jan 12 2006 12:02 AM
Thu Jan 12 2006 12:02 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 647
Rolla Mo
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sslick68 Offline
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sslick68  Offline
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Posts: 647
Rolla Mo
First of all I dont know why a company would only make one or two of something,the others just havent been found yet,new discoveries are found everyday.Maybe in a few rare cases this happens.Second I think that the only people getting hurt from this situation are the guys(roger and the Cali. guy) that actually own this particular globe as the value of it might decrease as a collector can now buy one for a couple hundred dollars.I think that maybe these guys deserve something?????This happened to the peddle planes and now Im stuck with an original one thats worth what a repro one is worth!My2cents

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Re: Where is this hobby headed? #22587
Thu Jan 12 2006 02:22 AM
Thu Jan 12 2006 02:22 AM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,187
Warsaw, Illinois
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chadrock00 Offline
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Warsaw, Illinois
I believe that alot of the things that are being reproduced is just a reminder that there are people out there that will do anything for a buck. If you have to steal an image, then copyright it, you had better make sure that there are more than two in the entire world. Anybody with a 6th grade education could realize that. What Tway is doing is wrong, and he will get caught when the time is right, and we will be buying bootleg globes and other items at auction for little or nothing. I too am young at this game, only being 26, but I have seen the best at thier best and the worst at thier worst, however you want to put it. I have seen men with thier pants down, such as Tway, and has seen a fist fight in a hotel lobby. I would like to consider everyone on the petro collectors list as a friend, but it is hard to with people in our petro society like this. Let's have a good time at Columbia this week!

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