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Just got this book today and was reading the value guides. Is it me or are they not the real world. I have watched auctions both flea bay and petroliana auctions, as well as swap meets and the prices today seem a whole lot higher than what is in the book.

The book is one persons interpretation of market value leading up to print. Tons of variables in there. biggest would be date of publicatio......how old are prices? Alot has changed in last 3 years.

Since the book was released = INFLATION

A book should never be used to determine value.

NEVER... that's a bold statement. Then why is PCM selling a globe CD (for the pictures and history)?? Exactly !!

NEVER... that's a bold statement. Then why is PCM selling a globe CD (for the pictures and history)?? Exactly !! [/quote]

same reason you watch pickers, for your entertainment..

I look at the prices as a guide to help me with buying or selling. In time some items go up in price and then go back down. I think Dan did a good job and he is very knowledgable in the gas and oil Collectables. Now what I said is all out the window when your at an auction you can never tell what people will do.

Guide books are snapshots in time.

Price valuations in those books by and large are either subjective(opinion of the writer/author) or they are reflective(based on real world sales public or private). Values given might still be accurate, but the longer out of date the more likely they are inaccurate. Economic changes, trends, fads, shrinking or widening of the market for the specific items covered can positively or negatively effect the values.

A simple value guide that is 20 years out of date may only be useful to identify a starting point in determining current value. Sometimes you may only have a 20 year old guide that mentions a specific item, with no modern listing available. Better guides provide useful background, history, identification and are worth keeping solely for those purposes.

Prior to the internet such books were the only way to determine value if you had no personal experience or access to someone with that experience. Today, a plethora of search engines can find many(but not all) citations from auctions, retail availability, speculations on sites like Oldgas, etc.

The old adage holds true "Somethings only worth what someone is willing to pay for it." A $10,000 painting 20 years ago may now be worth $15,000 or only $2000 to a prospective buyer. Today's market has shrunk for many "collectibles" of the past, driving down the values. On the other hand some markets are growing dramatically as people find interest in them, driving up the values.

Some guides use to put out updated value sheets, but many guides, especially very specific ones, only manage a couple of printings and become simply referential and sought after in their own right. I use to be into selling toy cast iron cap pistols, and the best guide book was only published once, contained all the known examples from an extensive collection and was 50 years out of date. Though the values weren't accurate, the pictures, history, and descriptions were invaluable at authenticating the pistols. That book was valued at $300-500 and only 300 were known to have been printed so ownership of one was like any other prized part of a collection.

So in the case of the OP book, if it's got good pictures and reference material then whether the pricing is accurate or not, it's value is still there for collecting purposes. And don't forget, you can keep updating that book, when you see an item sold you can add that value to a sheet or sheets you keep in the book.

I still have pest control books that have DDT as a recommendation. But some of the lifecycle information is still spot on, and is a good easy reference to locate the pest and learn it's scientific name, to use to do a more modern search.

I would like to add to the great post from Carolinaskies...

You still can get a rough idea of the value of items compared to each other and for the most part determine what might be rare tho watch out for exceptions. And I imagine just like the insect and disease books of old, the publisher may have pushed for controls/prices as a selling point for the book.

I'm looking at the book now , Author says prices are based on his 15yrs of selling at his auction house and collecting, some prices seem high, some seem low, some average. The stuff that is valued high is also mint 9.9/10 stuff also remember. (Although, the book has a mint Chevron pump plate valued at 1500,I bought one on eBay last week for 350 mines not mint but I'd say a 9+). But, thats how auctions go, like football any given Sunday. Anyways, I think it's a great book , lots of good info and lots of stuff I've never seen before. Perhaps the author should have put the value in more of a price range,example globe 800-1050 ? But, I dont think the author meant for the prices to be anything more that a guide and I would recommend the book to others.
p.s.
if the author never had prices listed people would be saying "why are no prices listed" it's a no win situation

This hobby is too large to use a book that specifies it covers the whole hobby. Get the books that cover the part of the hobby that interests you the most, these will have more accurate values.

When I wrote the first Gas Pump ID book I knew I couldn't put a value on over 1500 items accurately. I asked four seasoned gas pump collectors to help me. One on the east coast, two in the mid-west and one in California, plus my self here in the mid-west. I sent them all every picture that was to be put in the book asking them to put a value on the item. I added up all the values for a piece of equipment then devided by four. I think this was one of the best efforts to come up with a average value for the entire country.

One last thing, when someone questioned a value I had in the book I told them to look at the title, the last word was "GUIDE."

That is the way you should look at all books.

Jack Sim

The Chevron pump plate valued at $1500 is the porcelain version. Much harder to find than the tin version that regulary sells in the $250 to $350 range. Most the prices listed were realized at auction and we all know what can happen at auctions. It is a guide and not the gospel.

Thanks for the heads up Bill!

IMO, this is one reason to have books like this that lists RARE signs along with the hammer prices.

Thanks to Bill for sharing his knowledge with us new collectors. I for one, would have never guessed the reason for HIGH SSS for the Chevron pump plate (porcelain version).

Disclaimer: These are my personal opinions based on my experiences, yours may vary.

I would question setting a reserve based on a book value for the reasons discussed already about those values.

Second, a reserve value is to protect the seller from aberrant occurrences like lack of bidding action, lack of bidder interest.

Successful auctioneers I know hate reserves, but do understand the need some sellers have for them. In those cases they typically recommend the reserve be lower than book estimates by no less than 10% and as much as 25% unless the auctioneer's own experience values the item substantially different. Also, they recommend reserves only be used for a limited number of items at auction as the use is off-putting to many bidders and can sour the overall results of an auction. I've seen this happen at many auctions and result in a once active bidding crowd just clam up.

Reasonable reserves or auctioneers given permission to be flexible on reserves do often result in more successful auctions. Rare signs do deserve reserves, I'm not saying they don't. But if the auctioneer has done job and has serious bidders in the audience you can bet some have the same books the seller has gotten that value from. A reserve below stated values in a guide signal a seller knows a rare sign's worth but is willing to sell the item. Having a 10% leeway may be enough to promote the last two bidders to keep bidding knowing they are going to walk away with the sign.

For the auction scenario, you must factor in sales taxes, buyer and seller premiums that are to going to take a big bite out of the "net" numbers.

For everyone's information the values in the book are based on four things, auction results, shows (actual sales, not sticker price), private sales and guessmatics. All of prices in our book are actual prices unless there is a "?" behind the value. I can give you several example of where items in the book sold for a lot more than the prices we put in the book. The values in the book are also a guide not the gospel like Bill said.

This first book was also what I call a "Dream Book" because most of us will never have the chance to buy these items let alone have the money to purchase them, but if you have the chance to buy one below it's value, wouldn't it be nice to have an ideal of value?

We are just starting to work on our next book. It will have more oil companies plus service station accessories, like tires, batteries and the such.

If anyone has an question or wants to discuss anything in the book or anything you can call me at 217-259-7059.

Also I am looking for photos of rare & unusual tire & battery signs for the next book.

Thanks Dan