Oldgas.com Home

Home | Help | Events | Books | Pictures | Auctions | Links | Collectors | Parts | Contact

Page 4 of 5 < 1 2 3 4 5 >
Topic Options
#554048 - Thu Jul 17 2014 05:13 PM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: Gaspedler]
gulfiend! Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Fri Jul 01 2005
Loc: Raleigh, North Carolina
...I buy what I like, and can afford...I don't worry much about what an item is 'worth', so much as 'is it original and untouched?'...if I see something I feel is grossly underpriced but don't particularly enjoy, I'll pick it up - to lessen the stress the next time I see something I have to have, that's not underpriced...

...if you have to ask someone else 'what is this worth' every time you buy something, or consider buying something, you're not paying attention...if you have passion for this stuff, you can't help but absorb information about it...between the price guides, eBay, Worthpoint and the auction houses - not to mention the Oldgas archives - there's a WEALTH of information out there, right at your fingertips...very little of this was available 15-20 years ago - yet SOMEHOW we all muddled along, and bought what we liked/could afford/had the space for...

...it seems like 90% of the things posted in the value forum (1) are easily researched here or elsewhere, (2) in poor condition or uninteresting, and/or (3) are the same ten people asking 'what's this worth'...the few times something genuinely rare is posted, few people will give an accurate value, as they are potential buyers and there's a conflict of interest...

...I get it that there might be a few people who don't collect; who find this site on Google while trying to find out if the sign/can/globe they found/inherited/stole is valuable enough to pay for Junior's tuition/girlfriend's breast augmentation...but I've always thought Oldgas is most pertinent as a collector's forum - 'professional grade', if you will, and not as a watered-down version of 'Ask the Kovels' for the general public...

...I'll look at the Value Forum to see what's been found, and that's about it...maybe it is useful, at least to clear such questions from the other forums, but when I want to know 'what something is worth', I do my own research...
_________________________
Looking for better Gulf items: signs, globes, cans and paper - especially porcelain Gulf flanges, and Gulf A-38 & A-62 ad glass...

Top
Please use For Sale forums to sell

Please - NO offers to Buy or Sell in this forum category

Statements such as, "I'm thinking about selling this." are considered an offer to sell.
#554050 - Thu Jul 17 2014 05:15 PM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: gulfiend!]
Bob Richards Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Tue Feb 22 2005
Loc: Longview, WA
Well said, Mark!
_________________________
Looking for Tide Water/ Tide Water-Associated/ Tidewater items

Top
#554053 - Thu Jul 17 2014 05:20 PM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: gulfiend!]
Jarvis Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Wed Nov 01 2000
Loc: Evansville, In
Bingo... Gulfiend said it exactly how I would have said it!


Originally Posted By: gulfiend!
...I buy what I like, and can afford...I don't worry much about what an item is 'worth', so much as 'is it original and untouched?'...if I see something I feel is grossly underpriced but don't particularly enjoy, I'll pick it up - to lessen the stress the next time I see something I have to have, that's not underpriced...

...if you have to ask someone else 'what is this worth' every time you buy something, or consider buying something, you're not paying attention...if you have passion for this stuff, you can't help but absorb information about it...between the price guides, eBay, Worthpoint and the auction houses - not to mention the Oldgas archives - there's a WEALTH of information out there, right at your fingertips...very little of this was available 15-20 years ago - yet SOMEHOW we all muddled along, and bought what we liked/could afford/had the space for...

...it seems like 90% of the things posted in the value forum (1) are easily researched here or elsewhere, (2) in poor condition or uninteresting, and/or (3) are the same ten people asking 'what's this worth'...the few times something genuinely rare is posted, few people will give an accurate value, as they are potential buyers and there's a conflict of interest...

...I get it that there might be a few people who don't collect; who find this site on Google while trying to find out if the sign/can/globe they found/inherited/stole is valuable enough to pay for Junior's tuition/girlfriend's breast augmentation...but I've always thought Oldgas is most pertinent as a collector's forum - 'professional grade', if you will, and not as a watered-down version of 'Ask the Kovels' for the general public...

...I'll look at the Value Forum to see what's been found, and that's about it...maybe it is useful, at least to clear such questions from the other forums, but when I want to know 'what something is worth', I do my own research...
_________________________
Looking for anything from Hoosier Pete, Platolene 500 and Red Bird.

Top
#554059 - Thu Jul 17 2014 06:20 PM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: Jarvis]
Cold Pizza Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Tue May 17 2005
Loc: Illinois
I laugh the most when someone comes to this forum to ask what something is worth,right after they say they just bought it.
_________________________
Collecting Vintage Sunoco

Top
#554066 - Thu Jul 17 2014 06:32 PM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: Cold Pizza]
Dick Bennett Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Wed Oct 25 2000
Loc: Santa Paula, Calif
Originally Posted By: Cold Pizza
I laugh the most when someone comes to this forum to ask what something is worth,right after they say they just bought it.

"Look Honey, oldgas members Say I PAID 4X TOO MUCH for my new sign"!
OR
"Look Honey, they said it's worth 10X what I paid the 94 yr old man. Glad he didn't know what it's worth"!

laugh

Top
#554098 - Thu Jul 17 2014 08:57 PM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: Dick Bennett]
bppierce Offline
Petro Enthusiast

Registered: Sun Aug 19 2007
Loc: Round Rock, Texas
I never thought "value" was anything but what it would most likely sell for or cost to replace, which IMO is the same thing.

I don't think you can ever come up with that number correctly as it changes with so many variables. This is why I don't usually visit the value forum.

Why people that don't like the forum for one reason or another continue to visit it is a mystery to me. Seriously, if you don't like it, don't visit it. That concept can't be that difficult.


Edited by bppierce (Thu Jul 17 2014 08:58 PM)

Top
#554185 - Fri Jul 18 2014 07:49 AM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: Bob Richards]
H1HUMMER Offline
Petro Enthusiast

Registered: Wed Dec 05 2007
Loc: KENNEWICK, WA
Hmmmmm, you guys crack me up sometimes (okay most the time....lol ! We obviously have a few very different opinions on this and that's okay because mostly they all count.

I'm on the fence with this one and don't completely agree or disagree either way however YOU have the option to look or not look, reply or not reply and that's the beauty of it so I'm not really sure why it's such a big deal....there are way bigger things in this world to be upset over !

To me...the forum is sometimes really helpful and sometimes it's just a joke. I have to admit I have used it a few times & here's my excuse

I have a folder with most of my "*****" cataloged with pictures and behind each picture is a multitude of research pages of value including Ebay, Worthpoint, Value Guides, Web forums, etc. etc and yes that includes Oldgas members comments from the value page, my insurance agent told me this would be very helpful if anything was ever to happen(god forbid) my shed, shop, house or myself.

Yes, it's a lot of work as I try to keep it updated every 6 months to a year. Is there an easier way, sure several, is it really worth the effort, heck I don't know yet but it's not something I'm willing to risk and besides it keeps me out of trouble !

So ALL that being said, I personally would like to thank the few that have given me feedback on some of my items.

To me the value forum has value ! I think it's said very well above "I never thought "value" was anything but what it would most likely sell for or cost to replace, which IMO is the same thing"

Whew, my longest post ever, I'll try not to make a habit of it lol ! Tx Z



Edited by H1HUMMER (Fri Jul 18 2014 07:52 AM)

Top
#554316 - Sat Jul 19 2014 03:40 AM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: MARK SMITH]
Bbburke Offline
Petro Enthusiast

Registered: Tue Oct 08 2013
Loc: LaGrange, Kentucky
Bob. This is a serious question, not an attempt to argue. Im confused by were

you ended up going from what you originally wrote. You told Thermoman the

average of all his sales of one sign did not represent the value of that sign. That

his number was a re-sale figure. Then you went on later to explain the value to

be an average number from other auctions and private sales. Are you saying that Thermomans average couldnt be the value because it is based on one auction?

Personally, I wonder how or if a person could get an accurate value estimate based

on averages from a variety of different people, places and forms of sale. One

person could never comprise a list of sales that would be detailed enough to be

an exact value. I bounce back and forth with the idea of a value on this

Stuff a lot. On one hand, there seems to be a ballpark average on items,

Especially signs. On the ofher hand, there seems many impossible to gage factors

that can dramatically change the price at which something sells. First, condition

Of an item is something people cant seem to agree 100% on. Some people,

especially with signs, like a little ware and dont mind paying an 8 price for a

6 sign. Some people are really picky and consider certain ware or damage

To be a value killer. Second, the sellers position greatly influences a sale price.

If a guy is desperate to sell, he will probably have to take less than he would if he

Could wait for someone to give top dollar. Third, the knowledge and financial

financial position of the buyer plays a role. I see extremelly wealthy people

decide they want something and pay what it takes to get it. Not what its

Worth. If a person isnt knowledgeable about the value they also may pay more

. There are so many different unquantifiable factors that dictate sale

prices. How could someone factor all those in thoroughly to find an

accurate average with items that sell regularly all over the country.

I agree on were you are going with the idea that the numbers people offer arnt

truly values. Most are simply different peoples personal experiences with an

Item or an average comprised from a small amount of past sales they have seen.

Personally, im not sure if a true value can be defined or not wih the current sate

Of things When i start to think they can be, I will then see an instance of

An item Selling and the price being more about what the person was able to get for it. At this very moment, there are so many new people that

Have gotten into petroliana. The internet allowed a hobby to become more of

Industry of sorts. Were all kinds of people buy, sell and trade for a

number of a different reasons. What used to be a kind of secret society of like

Minded enthusiast, is now a free for all with a variety of people.

The internet allows people, without leaving their house, to gain access to stuff

that wouldnt of been able to get before. Some people dont

Have the time, experience or even desire to go out and find this stuff. Which

makes it possible to have variety of different types of buyers. Dealers,

Serious collectors, novice collectors, decorators, and so on. All willing to pay

Different prices for a variety of reasons.

Can there be a true set "value"? How do we determine what that number is?

It kind of seems to me that at the moment its impossible to answer those questions.








Edited by Bbburke (Sat Jul 19 2014 03:57 AM)
_________________________
Check out my finds at Mantiquities on Facebook!!!!

facebook.com/pages/Mantiquities/167580613447712

Top
#554332 - Sat Jul 19 2014 08:34 AM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: Bbburke]
Bob Richards Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Tue Feb 22 2005
Loc: Longview, WA
Brian, reading your post; I don't believe you have any idea what a value actually is. Or what the term means...

I am going to jump to a conclusion: But I don't believe it is much of a leap to say, that you have never had your Collection Appraised nor Insured... If you had, the Professional that did it, would have written down, how they determined the "Value" of your items... And most of the "Good Ones" actually share the basis of where and how they "came up with their valuation"...

But, you are not alone; Based on the replies, I am jumping to the same conclusion, that most on Oldgas don't understand "Values"; How they are determined and how they are used...

And if you folks don't understand what an actual value is. And therefore have no idea how to determine the actual value of an item?... Then why are so many, throwing out numbers in the "Value Forum"? Why, not leave the "Values" to the Professionals?!

And that defiantly, leaves me out!!! I don't follow results of sales closely enough, to give values on the Forum... So, I don't give values, on the Forum... I do like checking out the Value Forum... As, I have seen more than a few items, that are not common to the PNW... So, the Forum helps me further my education in the Hobby...

Just because one bought and/or sold an item for X amount of dollars... Is not the value... It is only what you bought or sold the item for!!!!!!

According to what I have read,so far.

If 1000 Members bought and/or sold the same item and received 1000 different financial results. Then there would be 1000 different values....

NO, there would have been 1000 different results of Sales... But, not 1000 different values... A Professional, would take the 1000 results. Look at the different circumstances and weigh each and everyone... Throw out the excessively high and low figures... And then determine the "Value" of the item....

That is why I suggested that instead of telling someone what the "value" of their item is... You place the caveat of; "The last one sold at auction for"; Or "I bought one for"; Or "I sold one for"....

PS: I am down to a few thousand results of Sales now... I used to get a list of Petro items auctioned; From a few different Auction organizations... (Also, if I see a "private sale" on Oldgas. And it is of an item, I follow... I send a PM to the Seller asking what the final selling price was... I'm not interested, most times in who the item was sold to... But, "private sales" from Collector to Collector usually are very close to what the "value" of an item really is... Both sides have a real good item of what a "fair price" is...)

Now I get a much more limited results list on the different "On-Line" Auctions... An example that you could do now: Print out the results of, say Peotone Spring Auction... There are results of over 700 sales... Even some images of different items with prices... But, all one needs is a Auction Catalog and one can match up the numbers... You have a date of the Auction... You have a general idea of who were bidding, Collectors -vs- Pickers -vs- Decorators...

But... Most are too lazy, to do such work....

Sorry, I said I was going to shut up and stay out of the discussion....
_________________________
Looking for Tide Water/ Tide Water-Associated/ Tidewater items

Top
#554346 - Sat Jul 19 2014 09:44 AM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: Bob Richards]
Ohio Oil Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Fri May 23 2003
Loc: Northwest Ohio
Brian...don't let anyone kid you, nobody I know in the hobby has professionals come in, do market research and give them a valuation on their collection. Insurance companies don't even do that. The ones I've dealt with let you set the amounts, the responsibility is yours to prove that number in event of loss.

Top
#554348 - Sat Jul 19 2014 09:57 AM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: Bob Richards]
Loyd Pierce Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Thu Jan 13 2011
Loc: Mt. Juliet, Tenn.
I was going to stay out of this and probably should. Bob is correct the only way to place value from sales is a lot of homework that very few are willing to do. Then after you think your there,condition and how rare the item must be factored in.
How many Oldgassers know how many fire chief pump plates was produced? (Just example). This one is easy there was alot,but I don't know therefore I'm not able to tell someone else what one is worth. If you are just out buying any company,or any thing that makes you excited,I don't see how you know value,or be expected to know value without a lot of years in this hobby under your belt. Take notice of the up coming auction listing Dan has just posted. It list a high a low and grade,now value is somewhere in between. Looking at what I just wrote I'm not able to give value,sorry life is to short and I got started in this hobby to late.
_________________________
*Wanted Pierce Pennant Petroleum*

Top
#554352 - Sat Jul 19 2014 10:25 AM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: Loyd Pierce]
strnge Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Mon Oct 23 2006
Loc: U.S.A.
Reading all your posts is giving me a tremendous laugh. None of you know the "Value" of your items. Your all arguing about the literal definition of the word "Value".

There is no set "value" of any piece any of us own! Each piece has a "MONETARY VALUE". (The property of having material worth, often indicated by the amount of money something WOULD bring if sold). (Straight out the dictionary)

So the title of the forum should be changed to MONETARY VALUE to stop all the bitching.

Have a nice day.
_________________________
Mike

Top
#554358 - Sat Jul 19 2014 10:56 AM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: strnge]
Bob Richards Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Tue Feb 22 2005
Loc: Longview, WA
I'm glad everyone is contributing... I don't always agree with what I am reading, but I'm glad the discussion is proceeding and hasn't been locked!...
_________________________
Looking for Tide Water/ Tide Water-Associated/ Tidewater items

Top
#554359 - Sat Jul 19 2014 11:20 AM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: strnge]
bppierce Offline
Petro Enthusiast

Registered: Sun Aug 19 2007
Loc: Round Rock, Texas
The definition for VALUE (according to merriam-webster.com) is:

Full Definition of VALUE
1) a fair return or equivalent in goods, services, or money for something exchanged


Ain't no way I'm ever going to agree with an insurance appraiser on what "value" is, definition or conclusion.

Here's a perfect example:
A few years ago I had my truck stolen.
I looked under the Kelly Blue Book (you know, the people that basically all they do is put "value" on things)
to see what my insurance company would most likely be giving me for my truck in excellent condition.
The number I came up with was $9,700.
My insurance called a few days later telling me that since I paid extra for "full replacement value" they were offering me $19,240.
I asked how they came up with the $19,000 and he told me they look through all the current outlets for used vehicle
and determined that was the price I was going to have to pay to replace my truck with a similar truck in the same condition, mileage and options..
I asked them what I would have received had I not paid for the full replacement premium and they told me $9,350.

So, please don't accuse me (or "most on oldgas") of not "having any idea what a value actually is. Or what the term means" because we or I don't agree with your opinion.
I respect your opinion and where you are coming from, but because I don't agree with it doesn't mean I'm clueless.

BTW, just for fun I went on Kelly BB to see how much my current SUV was worth.
After giving my zip code and filling out 3 pages of condition and options,
they were able to pinpoint the "value" to $16,503 - $21,127.

So much for values.



Edited by bppierce (Sat Jul 19 2014 12:53 PM)

Top
#554377 - Sat Jul 19 2014 02:17 PM Re: The "Value Forum" [Re: bppierce]
strnge Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: Mon Oct 23 2006
Loc: U.S.A.
My 1953 1,200 square foot, unremodeled house here in California is valued at $1,000,000.

It is only worth that because of what someone is willing to pay. (NOT ME!)

In other parts of the country, this house can be had for as low as $21,000.

This is just an example of the huge fluctuation in what someone values items that live in different areas across the country. This goes for everything that is bought and sold, period.
_________________________
Mike

Top
Page 4 of 5 < 1 2 3 4 5 >

Moderator:  Oldgas, Ryan Underthun, Watchdog9 

Click on magnifying glass icon on lower left to search eBay

Copyright © 2017 Primarily Petroliana Interactive, All Rights Reserved