Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums General Petroliana Discussion Thoughts for E-Bay repops

I thought a member on here had a friend with connections to E-bay as I had a crazy idea that maybe we could get them to work with us on educating Buyers.

My idea is that E-bay install a reproduction gallery to show the repops vs real for the buyers to look themselves.

I know it's a crazy idea but at least it would give us a piece of mind that they are trying to help be honest with their buyers. I know we can't fix stupid but it would sure feel better if they gave their buyers a chance to compare items and learn at the same time.

I know I get sick or reporting items that still get sold for big $$$$

What do you guys think and is their anyone on here who knows a way to get ahold of someone at E-bay who might work with us?

It would be great...That's why ebay probably wont ever do it...I report and report and report somemore...but its never ending... Yeah I was wondering about this ebay connection guy also. Brian

You can sell all the fake signs you want on there....But never put on a WW2 German item with a swastika its pulled so fast its like Blitzkrieg.

I couldn't be more with you Mike on this. But remember the bad guys who make the repops will be looking at the pictures too.

The problem is that working with eBay doesn't seem to work. Maybe working against them , so to speak, would be more effective. So if you know a media person who would be interested in a business story on eBay's failings then that might inform the public as well get eBay's notice and induce/entice change.

or a BB-gun

I'm with Fred. Public opinion is the only thing that would make e-Bay shun Profits.

E-Bay has a vested interest in generating profit...no vested interest in protecting people from themselves.

This is not an eBay problem; it's a societal problem. The sellers who represent fake signs as originals are crooks. Why should eBay be responsible for educating buyers in order to keep from being taken by a crook?

Look at it this way. Let's say I list my house for sale with a realtor. And let's say that I fail to disclose that the roof was leaking. Should the selling realtor be responsible for educating buyers on what to look for when buying a home? Should the realtor spend its own money to develop a website that educates buyers on how to identify problems with a home? Of course not. The buyer needs to do his due diligence in order to make an informed and responsible purchase.

The realtor simply brings buyers and sellers together. eBay is no different.

If the realtor continually sells houses with leaking roofs he will lose his license; that I can guarantee.

Your argument is flawed at so many levels that I won't get into it...simply because if you don't get it...nothing I can type that will make you smarter.

Here's a different approach being taken by someone who has had enough.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Texaco-Gulf-Shel...E-/251654191227

Reproductions are one thing but what do you have in mind for the fantasy items? You cannot picture originals that never existed.

Dave, this guy is a friend of mine. Bryan Backus. We discussed this idea a couple weeks ago and I have mentioned it before on this site. I was afraid to do it thinking ebay might end up taking my selling priveladges away. I can't believe he did it. That's awesome.

That seller from Germany actually pulled all his listings from ebay. So it must have worked. At least temporarily.

Ebay makes money from people selling repops, fakes, and fantasy items.

And....think about all the other area of collectables outside of what we collect that are likely experiencing the same problems.

I really don't think ebay cares about anything other than the bottom line.

I was on hold with ebay yesterday for 2 hours taking care of an exceedingly minor problem. If they cant handle basic customer service I dont see them helping to police reproductions versus real items. It be a nightmare for them, determing what was real and what was fake, i see why they would want to shy away from it. I dont see why they cant, however, suspend peoples accounts that have numerous complaints against them. The feedback system should take care of it one would think, but apparantly not!

Well they haven't noticed that this guy has posted a sign that isn't even for sale just to call out someone who is selling fakes. I'm pretty sure that would be breaking some rule.

Imagine the legal issue for eBay if they did this.
How can they determine with 100% certainty every, or ANY sign that comes in question, not to mention the cost in doing so?
I would be ticked if I owned an expensive original sign that eBay publically deemed a reproduction? My $18,000 sign is now tainted and worth about $200.
It's easy for us to pick out the repops/fantasy pieces, but would we be that quick if we had to pay $20,000-$30,000 in legal fees if we couldn't convince a judge that didn't know the first thing about Texaco marine signs or a T53 it's a reproduction? Things are MUCH different in court than on a message board.

Granted, there's no doubt it would eliminate quite a bit of the reproductions on their site, but it would also make them much too vulnerable. Basically they would be putting their necks on the line just to lose their precious revenue. IMO, I think they are already overstepping their boundaries with their much too bias "buyers protection". They're good ideas that have way too many flaws.

I'm likely the guy the OP is referring to as I do have connections to eBay fraud dept. I posted a thread awhile back following my attempt to shut down one of the eBay fraud sellers. I was able to get him investigated, they found shill bidding through multiple accounts, and they shut him down...... temporarily. He was back up and running in no time.

This will probably end up in me taking some heat, but I'll say it anyway. I need to be clear that any reference to oldgas.com isn't specifically targeting the mods, it's the general community here. That said, here are the things I've learned in the process:

1- eBay will not apply resources to chase these issues down. It simply doesn't make sense from a business standpoint. They are WAY to big to police the issue of "fraudulent items". They have literally millions of items they would have to police. Won't happen, not now, not ever. (not to mention they still make money when these items are listed and sold.)

2- The collector community complains, but when it comes down to it they accept it. Folks will complain all over the place, but that's about the length of what they are willing to do. Nobody takes their business elsewhere. In fact, I'm beginning to think the complaints are more an opportunity to let the world know that you have the knowledge to find a fake rather than fixing the problem.

3- IF you want to fix the problem, you need to take action somehow. I did this in several ways and was very surprised to find how many collectors (on this site specifically) criticized me for my efforts. I think folks just want something to complain about. I, for one, have taken my business elsewhere. I've gone through lots of effort to avoid supporting eBay due to this problem.

My efforts to actually DO something about this problem were not very welcomed on this site. After all, this site gets paid from eBay, so why would they want people to move to an alternative?

Bottom line: It's about the $$ all the way around. eBay won't change things because it will cost them $$. The collecting community won't quit using eBay because they THINK they get top $$ when they sell. This site will likely continue to support eBay because they get paid by eBay. It's about the $$.

Reminds me of a story my grandpa would tell us: an old farmer would sit on his porch and his dog would lay next to him. His dog was always howling. One day a guy stopped and asked what the problem is with the dog. The farmer said "He's laying on a nail and it's poking him in the belly." They guy asked why the dog doesn't just get up and move over a couple inches? The farmer replied "it doesn't hurt bad enough yet."

If (or when) eBay hurts bad enough you will stop the complaints and go somewhere else. I did.

LOL.... Your Site has less than 20 Petro items... And you are comparing it to Ebay; with their hundreds of thousands of Petro items..... Talk about being delirious!

As to the matter of repops and fantasy... I notice that you have such items on your Site... And one has to read deep into the description to finally read that the item is fake...

So much for being different than Ebay!

Talk about being delusional....comparing grains of sand to mountains.

Would either of you two care to tell me where I ever MENTIONED my website?

Both of you have proved my point.

Bob, you are way off on every point your trying to make. Anyone can check that for themselves. My question is this: why are you (and always have been) the first to jump down my throat? What ever happened that got you so angry with me? I don't think I've posted anything on OG that you haven't responded negatively towards. What's the deal?

You alluded to your Site, in your text...When you complained about the criticism you received on Oldgas to the changes you were attempting....

All I did was actually go to your Site and compare your Site, to ebay....

Since you talked about the changes you were making and how we shouldn't spend our money with ebay.... Most rational Members would "run with your own analogy"; And compare your Site with ebay... That is what you have been writing about and expressing that the Membership should look your Site over and dump ebay for your Site...

So, I did what you suggested. I compared your Site and its less than 20 Petro items; to the hundreds of thousands of Petro items on ebay....

I will stick with ebay... Others may have a different conclusion, to their comparison?....

Fair enough bob. So you don't "assume" I'm trying to talk members into leaving anything and going to another site, I will leave that topic alone. How about an answer to my other question?

He doesn't owe you any answers. Drop it, it's getting old!

I have never seen you contribute to a thread that provides any knowledge or assistance on gas pump history, restoration or the collecting of signs? You are another one those users of this site. You came to this site with an agenda and that was to promote your site. Others pay for their advertising, for some reason you want it for nothing.

I find it insulting and offensive when you attack the neutrality of this site and suggest that the moderators are somehow bias towards e-Bay. No one has been unfair towards you, they simply saw through you. If your site has failed to topple e-Bay, it's because you lack the finances to do it not because of the moderators.

Michael, I was just going to leave this question, unanswered... I figured you are frustrated with me and were asking a rhetorical question....

I have nothing against you personally... Hell, I've never met you and believe I've had less than a 1/2 doz PM messages with you...

When you announced your intent to setup a Site, to compete with ebay, I sent you a PM wishing you luck... I also said in my PM, I didn't think you would have much, if any success. And that more than a few Oldgas "New Member's" had made the same announcement that they were starting competing Sites to ebay and all of them pretty much disappeared within a very short period of time...

If someone berates me for spending my money with ebay or any other Site/person... And they aren't supplying me an alternative that is equal or even has more opportunities to "scratch the Petro bug"... I am going to comment...

Maybe I am being "hyper critical"? I don't believe that I am; But it is near impossible for me to judge my own actions and reactions.... Same as it has be hard for you to judge my comments and actions/reactions as they relate to you and your endeavors....

I hope you can make a go of it and ultimately compete; even if on a smaller stage than ebay...

I, like some others on Oldgas, am tied to my home/general area; because of some private problems... If you are going to raise hell with me and others on Oldgas... Make sure you have something that is a true alternative...

I usually bid on and buy, between 10 and 50 items a Month on ebay and Oldgas... I am a "Petro Junky".... And have been for 90% of my life... (while I surely can not be considered a "Spring Chicken" by more than a few, here. I am older than most on Oldgas)

I am outspoken. I am all too often considered; "a pain in the keister" (and all too often, that is true!). And at times, I act petty and very immature ( my only defense is: I am a times, very immature)....

I hope this answers your question?..... And I also, hope my reply gives an insight to those Members,that have been wondering why I am "so mean"? .... (I get those PM's, asking why I am so mean to some of the New Members, all the time...)

Thanks for the honest answer Bob. That explains it. That's the first time I've heard you admit to being a pain, immature, petty, and basically mean. Judging from your statement that you get PM's all the time from other members, I'm not the only one that has felt that way. Sure would make things more enjoyable (for many from what it sounds like) if you simply tried to be nice. Who know's maybe you would like it too. Being known as the mean guy can't be fun. Doesn't seem like that to me anyway. But, your choice. I don't have to reply or respond to you, I can hit the ignore button, right.

From day one I have said I am NOT trying to compete with eBay. You have always put those words in my mouth time and time again. I have only stated that I'm trying to create an alternative to eBay. Another choice that would hopefully grow into something worthwhile. I'm not stupid enough to think that I can step in and create a bigger better eBay on zero budget with little skills.

That said, my site has served it's intended purpose. I sold many of my own items, all at my own efforts, and saved a significant amount of money in fees by doing so. More importantly, I've had fun doing it. I still am. I'm still going to keep the site rolling because I enjoy a challenge. It's an additional way for me to "play" in this hobby.

Dave Gill- I've intentionally ignored your last several comments since you're making ridiculous (untrue) claims and seem to be gunning to be Bob's "side kick" (or mini-me?) lol.... No use arguing over the internet with people like that. That's a losing proposition in my book.

I'll bow out (again). Have fun boys. Hopefully you find a desire to be more kind in general. I think many would appreciate that.

Fire away. I'm done with this one. Y'all can have the last word.

LOL.... If you ever read my posts... You would have read, me saying those things about myself, in probably close to 100 posts...

As I said, I hope your Site is successful...