Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums General Petroliana Discussion Help to ID National pump

Hello all,

I am new to this hobby but have got my first pump lined up. I have some information and photos and would ask for some knowledge on what I have.

It is a National and I believe it was labeled as a Flying A. Here are some numbers on the tag.

B-PEH - 08961 and I believe a date code of 6-53

On the bottom of the tag are the numbers 83426. I have found some photos of similar pumps but nothing with the 100+ OCTANE.

Also, is this a pump that could be changed to a different brand such as Shell or Sinclair if I wanted without hurting value. I am actually wanting to restore it as a display in my shop and have no intentions on selling it. I just would like to know some back ground information on it.

One last thing, would this pump have a globe and would it be a 13.5 inch or bigger. Please excuse my lack of knowledge. I am trying to learn as I go here

Happy Thanksgiving and thank you in advance for any help.
Tom

National A62. It's a porcelain pump. Use some paint stripper to get the paint off and you may have a really nice, original pump you can display as-is. They usually didn't have globes.

“NATIONAL 62, 1948-1951.
Tokheim pump with National name, curved ad glass panels.”

Excerpt From Jack Sim's book.

If the ad glass is original to the pump? Then based on Tidewater Flying A advertising, the pump was in use until approx 1960... (Tidewater used that 100+ Octane design/logo from the later part of '58 to 1960)

You are all wrong. First this pump is basically the Tokheim 300 with a different top, and the stainless trim & the ID tag says National. Tokheim acquired National, they stopped making the National pumps where the letter in the ID tag was first, then the number (example A-38). Tokheim changed the model numbers to be number first, then the letter. Take a good look at the ID tag above, this pump is a 64-B. The 64 had the 17' hose, where the 62 had a 12" and the 66 had a 14.'

Picturers of all three pumps are shown on this page http://petrolianacollectibles.com/national%2062a-64b.htm

I also suggest you get a copy of my Gas Pump ID book, but the book is out of pring and a few show up on Amazon for about $125.00. But, Amazon does sell a e-book copy of my book for less that $15.00. They quit sending me royalities a couple of years ago, so I don't make any money anymore.

I believe what you have is a porcelain pump, be carefilly with it, they chip easy. Use a good paint remover and polish the porcelain

Jack Sim

SO, what he has is a National A62 correct?

Sure looks like a National A62 to me.

I'm not a member of the pump police, I say it's your pump, do it like you want. I do draw the line with porcelain pumps however. I would not change this pump from Flying A unless the porcelain was completely shot. It would be a shame to destroy good porcelain to rebrand. I also wouldn't want to keep the current green and brand it Sinclair. If you get a great deal on it, I would get it and make a trade on a 700 series Bennett with the large ad glass window and brand as Sinclair or trade for a Tokheim 39 and do it up in Shell. I sure wouldn't pass on this pump if it's a good price. And even better thing to do is get this pump, clean it up and leave it like it is, and go out and buy another pump to do up in Sinclair or Shell. Two is better than one! Brady

I beg to differ. The pump is a tokheim 39 basically except for the ad glass top. It is a national a62. The tokheim 300 platform is the basis for the national 360. Someone could have swapped out id tags at one point. It would look good with the paint stripped off to original porcelain but it is your pump and do as you please with it.

I would say you are right Phil about the ID tag being changed as the mounting screws do not look like factory twist rivets or screws. Can not tell from the pictures but the top looks to have the globe mounting platform on it. Have seen a lot of these ad glass top pumps in the past but only 3 or 4 of them with the globe mount platform.

Good eyes Don! It does look like it has a globe blank...I've only seen one or two of those myself. Phil is 100% right on the platform...Tokheim 39...not 300.

I do appreciate all of the knowledge I have gained here. Yes from what I see, there is a provision on the top for a globe whether it was original or not I do not know. Secondly, I do agree that the screws holding the ID tag do not look original.

Now that I think of it, I do agree that changing brand would not be a good idea. From what I can see, the Flying A is unique to the green porcelain color.

I appreciate the advise and 99% sure I will get this pump. I will keep you all posted with future developments.

Thank you all,
Tom

Try removing the top left screw of the id plate. You may see a 64 there. I have seen a A63 which was the same pump as a 62. They may have made slight changes in the pump and then changed the production number. Richard

I stand corrected on the 39/300 part, too much wine with that turkey.

But,

The ID tag states 64-B-PEH.
The original sales literature states 64-B Low Pump, and both pieces of sales literature I have call these pumps the "60 Series."
The Repair Parts Manual states 64.

No letter in front of the model number, that was only used before National became part of Tokheim.

The green porcelain pump is shown on this page: http://petrolianacollectibles.com/national%2062a-64b.htm

Jack Sim

Looks like a National 64 to me. Here is mine with the original globe setup.

Here is my A-64

Your pump is beautiful and makes me want to restore mine to original now that I see a version of it done.

Very nice work there.
Tom

Nice pump, Matt!!!

Thanks, I did not do much to it. I cleaned some overspray off the pocelain, repaired two of the stainless trim, had the doors powder coated (the original porcelain doors were missing)and installed the decals that came with the pump. It still needs door glass and rubber.

Very Very nice Matt.

I have a thing about collecting these! They are very low maintenance. It is a model 64 not that it really matters. Only minor differences between the 62 and 64.

Rob

Gotta love the porcelain pumps!!

Nice line up!!!

Hello all,

I thought I would share the latest on my pump project. I finally moved it from its current location (father in laws) to my shop.

I took some photos of it during the dis assembly process. It is rather dirty inside and it did have some very "oldgas" in it which I am still trying to get out of my cloths.

As we discussed prior, I am happy with the fact that it is an A64 National pump.

I am thinking about restoring it to its original "Flying A" brand but also leaving the guts in. I want to make the inside look like it was built for a show, so not really completely original under the covers. I may be doing some powder coating, chrome plating and using some polished brass hardware to spruce it up a bit. I will try and keep everyone posted on progress. The first steps will be to clean each of the components. I have access to chemical hot tank and acid tank and media blaster.

Another note, the pump seems to have a globe mount top which I am not sure was common on these pumps. If not, is it add more value to the pump and would it be worth doing a 100% factory correct restoration instead of my show stopper plan?

Who is the best source of restoration parts for this pump? I am going to need a few things such as decals, the curved add glass and correct globe, as well as other items.

This should be fun. Thank you in advance for any help or suggestions,

Take care,
Tom

You can do the outside correct original and still do the guts all show stopper. Most pumps guys gut them (including myself) so it would be cool to see them all fancy and shiny.

You should post a better picture of your top, it looks like it may be a station lighter top. These pocelain pumps usually did not have globes.

I will get a better photo of the top soon. What do you mean by "station lighter top"? I am a novice at these pumps but love learning about them.

Thank you,
Tom

A station lighter pump has a pole with a light shade sticking out of the top of the pump. There were many styles from different pump companies. Here is a Gilbarco that I put a wayne station lighter on.

Now I understand, thank you for the explanation. Are these station lighters hard to find? I think it is cooler than a globe to be honest. I like globes and all but this from what I see, does not seem very common and that is what I really like about it.

Thanks again Matt,
Take care,
Tom

They are not easy to get but are out there. The National station lighter was kinda plain. Just a round pole. Bennetts also used a round pole. I could not find a picture, but here is a Bennett. The National looks real close to this.

I have two for a Bennett as shown, you would need the piece that goes next to the pump though.

Here are a couple of close ups of the top.

Is that center piece rubber? I would say it is a station lighter top but it has been so long sense I seen the two pumps with station lighters. I do not remember the screws. I have been told by one than one person that there were three tops for these pumps, one with no globe, one with globe holder and one for station lighter. I also had some one tell me there were only two tops so maybe some one else can help out here. If you take that cap off and get a globe holder for a Tokheim 39 it will bolt right in place useing those screw holes.

I enlarged the picture on your frame, the light unit on the top of it looks like it is made for a piece of pipe to fit in. If that is the case then it was a station lighter pump originally.

Matt,

Yes that is a rubber insert in the middle of the hole. What I am confused about is how does the pole for the light mount? Does it slide though the rubber grommet? If so, it does not seem to have much support if I am looking at it correctly.

Do you have some close ups of how this light pole would mount?

Thank you for all of your help.

Take care,
Tom

It appears the pole would be threaded and screw right into the light unit mounted on top of your frame. Then the harp and bonnet light fixture would go on top of the pole.

OK, I will get you some photos of the top of the frame. i can see where there are wires coming out for a electrical connection but there is nothing threaded there, that I noticed anyway.

Stay tuned, I will get some photos.

Take care,
Tom

OK, probably not for the purist here and not sure where it is going but I had the up rights powder coated "wagon red" and the shelf's are painted with a metallic charcoal grey color. This will be in no way shape or form in the original form as far as cosmetics go.

This is the beginning of my madness. Stay tuned for more. I am happy that it is going back together now.

Sorry for the ***** phone photos. It does look great in person

Take care,
Tom

By the way, the bottom shelf has rubber insulators on all 4 corners. It looks like there is one on each side of the shelf with a metal plate on both sides as well.

Does anyone know here to get replacements for these? I see they are assembled on the shelf with some type of flared out sleeve???

I am not sure if the original style is available but would consider something close to it.

I can post photos of the metal plate but the rubber insulators are all but gone from age.

Thank you in advance,
Tom

Looks nice so far but the bottom shelf I do not use back.

Looks nice so far but the bottom shelf I do not use back.