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Done4 Offline OP
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Lately there seems to be a lot of discussion on the authenticity of some of the pieces within these auction houses. Is it me that it seems much like ebay sellers you now can not trust or have faith in the auction houses. Their attitude in my opinion are much like ebay in that there is no dialog about suspect/suspicious items they are selling.

They claim that they have the expertise and knowledge on items they are representing. My only hope that their creed does them in and the ones that are honest rise above these houses. But who really are they and how do we really know? It's unfortunate the direction all of this has taken. Like I said is it just me or am I missing something.


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its not just you.


Wanted: Sweney Oil items - Peoria, IL
Weekly Oil Can Auctions: www.OilCanAuctions.com
Collection & Items for Sale: www.OnceAlwaysPetro.com
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It's Not Just You!
I like Dan Matthews and trust his stuff 90% of the time and the 10% is because a few years back at Iowa for their auction, I pointed out the "fake Sinclair PPP" that we all know is repop. His response was that how do we know it wasn't done by another manufacturer of Sinclair. I told him the story and he said he would make a comment but when it came up he wasn't doing the auctioning and nothing was said....Someone paid over 200 for a $19 PPP.


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Mike

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the ALL MIGHTY DOLLAR$ ... cool


RANDY
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I would hate to be a newbie now days.


Looking for Keystone,Pure,Sinclair,Texaco,Sterling and Gulf...Thanks, Brian
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Hmmmmm.....where do you even begin. Clown faced bafoons....it gets worse every year.

How can you possibly expect a business to understand the importance of authenticity.....when they depend on forgeries and fakes to pad the profit.


see me at Mason Dixon Gas, Spring Carlisle M114-115, and Hershey C4E-35.
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You are not alone. There's been a few repo Texaco items go through auction. Nobody knows it all, especially with all the brands out there. It took me 15 years alone with just Texaco.

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I think it's only going to get worse as time goes on and true collectors will only deal amongst each other. Maybe that is the way it should be?


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as long as the number of people making this a business & putting food on the table via selling this stuff continues to increase, so will the greed that goes along with it.

its a source of income that leads to better living for them, so if they can take advantage of it by misleading people or gouging the uninformed buyers, they will. cause that means a new car, a new home, a new tv, etc.


Wanted: Sweney Oil items - Peoria, IL
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Originally Posted By BryceG
as long as the number of people making this a business & putting food on the table via selling this stuff continues to increase, so will the greed that goes along with it.

its a source of income that leads to better living for them, so if they can take advantage of it by misleading people or gouging the uninformed buyers, they will. cause that means a new car, a new home, a new tv, etc.
Its sad but Bryce is 100% Right.


Looking for Keystone,Pure,Sinclair,Texaco,Sterling and Gulf...Thanks, Brian
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Why does it seem that there is always a witch hunt with some of you guys, or a group of people who want to throw so many people under the bus with one broad stroke?

IMO, the big auction houses do a pretty good job of bringing things to the table that you would sometimes never even get a sniff of owning. To say that the odd repro piece goes across the block is one thing, but to insinuate that they do it to pad the numbers is blasphemy.

Some of them deal with hundreds of brands and thousands of signs every year while some of you might only have a dozen go through your own hands. To say that they own the burden of knowing each and every piece is original or not is a little bit over expectant it? Think about it, you deal with a few brands in your own collection and perhaps you know a lot about the repop pieces within your own brand, now multiply that by 500 other brands where there are dozens of repop items that come into play, and you expect them to know about all of them? Really?

So you hold an auction and you have 800 items going across the block. You do your best to inspect them for quality and originality and you're comfortable knowing what is what. Now some guy you don't know comes up 20 minutes before the auction and says that such and such piece is a repro and perhaps being on the fence you have to discount that item on "some guys" word and do an injustice to the customer who has listed the item, all because some garage expert came up to you and said so? Do you assume you've made the mistake and that the guy is right, or is the guy simple trying to get you to announce it's repro so he can maybe get a piece he wants at a bargain because you've now scared others away?

See what I mean? Put the show on the other foot and factor in how many times they hear that of a good piece where someone tries to discount it's authenticity to gain an upper hand at a sale. I think the reputable auction houses do a great job with representation of most items, and accept that the odd piece will go across that isn't real.

To me, that [u]puts the onus back onto you[/u], the buyer who's sitting there with the bid card and all the knowledge of the brand and the piece you're about to bid on. Do your home work, know what you're bidding on before you raise your hand, and quit with the witch hunts on the auctioneers. They are only one piece of the puzzle, and you are the one who should know what you're buying. If you don't then you shouldn't be sitting there in the first place.

It's your money so you had better have done your own due diligence before you start handing it out and then blame someone else for your own mistakes. If you think the auction houses are all distrustful and that they all run ***** across the block deliberately , then start your own auction house and see how you do with honest Ed's auction service. At least then you'll have a clear conscience, or maybe until someone points out that you missed a piece and throws you under the bus for what was maybe "an honest mistake"?

And that's my rant for the day, as so many computer based collectors think they are so much more knowledgeable than everyone else.

Earl

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Done4 Offline OP
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Oil King, Earl, you missing the point. My concern is there no accountability. My question was not directed to an expert like you but to the dangers of the new, excited collectors entering this hobby. I'm long in the tooth collecting this stuff and just have concerns what has been an issue with ebay and now some auction houses. What you have said is common knowledge with us old farts but the cost of entry is becoming edgy.

You obviously are comfortable with the trends and choose not to call to attention that there is are. Not sure that will help this hobby.

To quote you - Some of them deal with hundreds of brands and thousands of signs every year while some of you might only have a dozen go through your own hands. - I find this a very negative demeaning statement by you, we just want to know that the few we get are authentic. What am I missing?


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I was burnt two times when I first started collecting signs , the excitement of finding signs and was told that they were original from the 50s made me jump right on them with no research because I thought the person would never lie to me just to make a buck . The fine line is always that just because I may not have ever ran across an item it may still be real so don't call someone out unless you are sure and just because we question where something came from we are not throwing you under the bus. I can tell you that there is so much knowledge here you will never have to buy a repop if you just listen because I can assure you I will always ask when in doubt . If somebody is too proud to ask they will end up with a closet full of garbage.


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If you don't make any noise no one will hear you!
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Originally Posted By BryceG
as long as the number of people making this a business & putting food on the table via selling this stuff continues to increase, so will the greed that goes along with it.

its a source of income that leads to better living for them, so if they can take advantage of it by misleading people or gouging the uninformed buyers, they will. cause that means a new car, a new home, a new tv, etc.


I agree with the uninformed buyers getting taken advantage of but also believe that new collectors will learn early on after being burned on a repop or two as most of us have throughout this Hobby.

Lets Just keep paying the information forward and educate as many as we can!

And if your at an auction and see something being sold as something it isn't, please let them know as many auction employees need a little education now and then also! LOL


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Mike

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I have dealt with Dan Matthews first hand . I can tell you he wants no fakes, ever in an auction he is involved in .He was excellent with me . This week I had a high end collector call me on a sign that is going thru an auction in the USA it is a high end sign .He asked my opinion , This piece is not right at all . An auction house is like any business ,if you have 800 pieces going over the block , then its your job to authenticate 800 pieces . That's why you make the percentage of profit you do . I have collected since I was 13 , things have changed a lot . BryceG and Done4, you guys are right on. Nowadays a lot of trading and selling goes on between respected collectors . Ebay seems to be fading in any high end items , because they do not police fake sellers . I would buy from Dans auction , without worry that he stands behind what he sells . I have been in business for 25 years , I would never deceive a customer and expect to stay in business . Neither should a reputable auction house .Just my humble opinion .

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