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28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! #715939
Thu Aug 30 2018 07:22 PM
Thu Aug 30 2018 07:22 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 184
Katy TX
lando-4 Offline OP
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lando-4  Offline OP
Petro Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 184
Katy TX
Was browsing LiveAuctioneers and Proxibid tonight looking to see what globes are coming up for auction and noticed Internet premiums as high as 28%. Crazy! Guess if you have fools that pay it, why not charge it. laugh


Greg
On the lookout for Marland Oil / Conoco Globes
Please use For Sale forums to sell

Please - NO offers to Buy or Sell in this forum category

Statements such as, "I'm thinking about selling this." are considered an offer to sell.
Re: 28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! [Re: lando-4] #715973
Fri Aug 31 2018 08:28 AM
Fri Aug 31 2018 08:28 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 84
CT, USA
J
jecos Offline
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jecos  Offline
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J
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 84
CT, USA
I might be in the minority here but I generally don't care what the BP is when it comes to auctions, live or online. When I bid, I know how much I want to spend "out the door" on an item, and I adjust my bids based on the BP (I also consider shipping costs if its online). I assume most bidders with half a brain do the same thing. If so, then the consignor feels the pain of higher BPs since they generally only get a cut of the hammer price. I'm re-posting this link to an article I posted a couple years ago that discusses this:

http://www.antiquetrader.com/featured/buyers-premiums-price-auction-business/

A couple years ago I was at a big antique show and I got to talking to a dealer that had a couple Wayside Approved signs. I mentioned I had just picked up 2 in a local auction. He asked me how much and if there was any juice. I told him I paid $200 apiece with 18% BP. He laughed and jokingly said that only suckers pay BP. I asked him what he paid for his signs and he told me about $350 apiece. What else could I say?
Joe

Re: 28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! [Re: lando-4] #715979
Fri Aug 31 2018 10:25 AM
Fri Aug 31 2018 10:25 AM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,061
Texas USA
M
Morgan Offline
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Morgan  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2000
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Texas USA
Figure in gas, hotel, eating out, misc, you may come out ahead to pay BP and shipping.

Re: 28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! [Re: Morgan] #715990
Fri Aug 31 2018 04:52 PM
Fri Aug 31 2018 04:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 184
Katy TX
lando-4 Offline OP
Petro Enthusiast
lando-4  Offline OP
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 184
Katy TX
For an item worth $1,000 item, you add $280 to that + $100 shipping (if a globe - what I'd be buying), I'd rather pay that $380 toward a good hotel, good food, good conversations with fellow collectors, and being at the auction in person so I can actually see what I'm bidding on vs. lining an auctioneer's pockets with internet buyers fees. You or your kids will not likely ever recoup the money you paid for buyer fees and shipping when it comes time to get rid of the item. Just my opinion. Others, may be more of the hermit type and prefer to stare at a computer screen for hours watching an on-line auction. To each his own.

Also, if you adjust your bidding to account for a buyer's fee and for shipping - well good luck getting the good stuff. Granted you'll get lucky some days, but I'd bet 9 out of 10 times you'll be disappointed. Again just my opinion.


Greg
On the lookout for Marland Oil / Conoco Globes
Re: 28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! [Re: lando-4] #716005
Fri Aug 31 2018 08:27 PM
Fri Aug 31 2018 08:27 PM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 84
CT, USA
J
jecos Offline
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jecos  Offline
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J
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 84
CT, USA
Let's get something straight. The majority of auctions have a buyers premium, whether you're a live bidder or an internet bidder. I believe that the internet BP is typically 3-7 % higher because the hosting site, such as proxibid or liveauctioneers, gets a fee for their service. So even if you you are physically at the auction and you win that item for $1000, you're probably going to pay an additional $150-200 in BP fees (15% BP is pretty standard for auction houses with live bidding here in the northeast). If you're a live bidder and don't have a sales and use tax permit, you probably will also get hit with a state sales tax, which often doesn't apply to out-of-state internet bidders. So the lower BP may be offset by a sales tax for live bidders, depending on whether you're a dealer or just a collector. Shipping of course can be expensive if its a big sign or a globe, but there are auction companies that offer shipping for very reasonable rates when your talking medium size signs or smaller, non-fragile items.

Bottom line - if you bid $1000 on an item that you value at $1000, then most likely you've overpaid based on the BP, whether you are there or not.

Greg you are correct, sometimes you have to pay up for an item if you don't want to go home skunked. If you attend a quality advertising auction, you're probably going to have to compete with every collector within a 100 mile radius, as well as the internet bidders, if that service is offered. If a few knuckleheads show up, then prices on some stuff may go through the roof, not even factoring the BP. But if the crowd is level-headed and understand the impact of the BP on the cost, then the hammer prices will go below retail and the consignor takes the hit. Either way I've gone to auctions and come away with great deals and I've also come home empty-handed. I don't mind paying up once in a while but there have been times where I couldn't justify the prices things were selling for.

As far as internet bidding goes you don't have to stare at the computer monitor all day. I often just leave on-line pre-bids, which is a good way to avoid getting caught up in auction fever. A lot of them don't pan out but I've been pleasantly surprised more than once when I've won something for far less than my max pre-bid.

I still stand by my opinion that the increasingly higher buyer fees hurt the consignors more than the buyers in general, if the buyers have any common sense. From what I can tell, the high BPs are not discouraging the bidders, online or live, at least when it comes to gas and oil stuff. Its probably going to require pushback from the consignors to prevent further increases.

Re: 28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! [Re: lando-4] #716007
Fri Aug 31 2018 08:37 PM
Fri Aug 31 2018 08:37 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,212
Portland Oregon
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Craig Osbeck Offline
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Craig Osbeck  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,212
Portland Oregon
Do not buy anymore from these auctions, way too high of premiums. I believe that it hurts the sellers of this stuff and will continue. This is not something that is going away sadly. I do not care about all the stories of how much this or that cost, To high of premiums.


Craig
Re: 28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! [Re: lando-4] #716018
Sat Sep 01 2018 06:23 AM
Sat Sep 01 2018 06:23 AM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,440
MICHIGAN
Steven C. Online content
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Steven C.  Online Content
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Posts: 4,440
MICHIGAN
I've only been in the hobby for about 7 years. When first in the hobby the BP's were about 12% and some had just moved to 15% or so. Which I figured was reasonable. It seems every year they creep up a couple %. It wasn't long after I was in the hobby, 2013-2014ish that the hobby started to really jump up. And with that jump the BP's went up and they quickly hit 20% and some people were freaking out. I know I was *****. The premiums had well outpaced the common sense economics of running an auction business and could only be supported by the auction houses taking advantage of the rise in the hobby. I said it then and I'll say it know, if the auction houses can support the number based on the business model, (expenses/overhead, a fair market profit.....) then fine. It is what it is. But no way!!! I don't believe for a second that they can. It's just greed and lets just raise it and get all we can get.

And yes, the BP may pull back the actual purchase price for an item just a bit some times. But, a $1000 sign is still gong to cost $1000!! Plus BP! As someone said above, if you think your going to get that $1000 sign for $750, plus BP to get to the $1000, you'll be going home empty handed every time. You have to ask Sigmund Freud to explain it to you. It's something in human nature.


Last edited by Steven C.; Sat Sep 01 2018 06:27 AM.

Steve Coppens
Always interested in Sunoco items!
Really want a Sunoco National pump ad glass!!
Re: 28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! [Re: lando-4] #716063
Sun Sep 02 2018 07:56 AM
Sun Sep 02 2018 07:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,212
Portland Oregon
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Craig Osbeck Offline
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Craig Osbeck  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2009
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Portland Oregon
Plain and simple, Its a turn off and I do not need the items that bad.


Craig
Re: 28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! [Re: Craig Osbeck] #716078
Sun Sep 02 2018 11:53 AM
Sun Sep 02 2018 11:53 AM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 25
Montana, USA
R
RMikita Offline
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RMikita  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 25
Montana, USA
Originally Posted by Craig Osbeck
Plain and simple, Its a turn off and I do not need the items that bad.


I agree completely! when I see 28% BP, I close it out. Also, what are they getting from the consignor, another 25%?

Re: 28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! [Re: lando-4] #716080
Sun Sep 02 2018 12:54 PM
Sun Sep 02 2018 12:54 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 171
Green Bay, WI
UpnorthNeil Offline
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UpnorthNeil  Offline
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Posts: 171
Green Bay, WI
Buyers premiums as well as the salaries of professional athletes are approaching criminal levels IMO. Unfortunately as long as there are deep pockets and a willingness to pay those amounts don't expect this insanity to slow down.

Re: 28% Internet Premium - Unbelievable! [Re: lando-4] #716115
Sun Sep 02 2018 08:13 PM
Sun Sep 02 2018 08:13 PM
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 324
Midland, Michigan
BrianH Offline
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BrianH  Offline
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Joined: May 2016
Posts: 324
Midland, Michigan
I've bought items both from shows like Peotone and CTO as well as online at some of the big houses like Morphy. Personally, I like the shows better. I can see what I'm buying "in hand" so there's no surprises, I get to meet a lot of great guys and develop friendships and it's just fun to look at what's out there. However, some items only seem to show up at the big auctions (rare stuff or very high-condition stuff), at least in my experience. So, we're faced with either waiting for something to show up at a show or paying the outrageous BPs and getting that hard-to-find item now. Not saying there isn't rare stuff at the shows - there just seems to be more of it available in the big auctions. It's not like I can AFFORD that 25K sign at the moment anyway though....

BrianH


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