Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums Showcase and Stories, Petroliana Globe of the month first time!

Well I volunteered for “of the month” feature and was asked to do globe of the month. I will host GOTM every month on the 25th. I want to start with the different types of bodies made as we have many new collectors that might not know the difference.
Capco bodies is where we will start.
Some new collectors think capco bodies are reproductions which isn’t true. Capco bodies came out in the early 30’s. The early bodies actually had a right and left half unlike the later bodies which the right and left are the same. Early bodies at the top where the screw goes is different. There are many colors out there. I will post pictures of the differant style of capco bodies.

Looking forward to this... Thanks John

T

Here is the late style capco verses the early style capco. Early style on the right dates to the mid 30's.



Repop bodies and old bodies?
When you look through the bottom of a capco the lenses have notches at the 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock areas. There is a plastic piece in the bodies that line up the lenses. Originals will have 2 notches and repop's will have 1.




I will get more into capco lenses verses glass body lenses when we cover the glass bodies in the next day or so.


Any questions on capco bodies before we move to glass bodies?


I want to say thanks to Bob (lastgas) he kept me from going out to the garage and taking my globes apart to get a picture. Affraid i would break something? LOL


[This message has been edited by Jarvis (edited 05-27-2007).]

I had an e-mail from an oldgas member wanting to see some colored capcos and a wide body capco. Phillips was the biggest user of wide capco bodies. I don't have any colored capco bodies besides blue and red and green. Any body has and Capco globes to share please do so.

I have 2 white Capco bodies that I had thought were original. Both came with original lenses in them, at least one the lenses been in them since the 60,s or longer.

They are both hard plastic, but the lip at the top does not go all the way across. I think the notches are as described for the repro on here.
Is there a chance that the Capco tooling had changed to this style on the original hard plastics, and then ended up in use for repros later??

How far back does anyone know of repro Capco's being made, and if they are made from the real molds would they not simply be a later production original??

[This message has been edited by dodogas (edited 06-03-2007).]

The fisrt capco's were made of a harder material. They are the ones where the halves are different as shown in John's post. The old style capco's were made in 1932-33. They are much more ridgid and often discolored.

All original capco's both new and old style have two locating tabs in each half. This goes for the old style wide capco's too.

The repro bodies have one tab per half. That goes for both the ones marked Capcolite like the originals, and those without the any markings. Its possible that there are repro's with 2 tabs ber half but I've never seen one.

Doesn't matter if they are made on original molds or not, a repro is a repro!

Maybe someone can post a picture of a repro capco showing how they only have one tab per half.

If anyone doesn't have a repop capco to send me I will take one of mine apart and get a photo. I will post a photo of a repop capco then if there aren't anymore questions then we will move to glass bodies. These will take some time! So many people get confused on glass bodies.

Here you go JJ, don't want you to take any of your globes apart and start the curse up again. Richard

I have 2 white hard plastic bodies, which were described as original.

At least 1 has single notch, both have lip going 1/2 way from bolt indent.( I edited and changed that on my first post)

At least 1 of them has 3 (evenly spaced over 5 or 6 in)casting marks like shown in the middle of the last pic, but around 3/4" in dia.

Any chance there was another variation?

How old are these, and are they repro? I have had someone that has had a lot of globes tell me they were original.

[This message has been edited by dodogas (edited 06-03-2007).]

Frank,
Your globes are the later style (looking at the top the lip only goes half way across) which is more common.

Look at the picture Richard posted. You can clearly see there is only one locating tab. If your bodies look like that they are clearly reproductions.

Starting glass bodies.
First is a regular narrow glass body.


Next is the same version but wide glass body.


Looking at them from the side.


People have asked how do you tell the difference between the repop and originals. There is no difference! The originals have no consistency on weight so weighing them doesn't work. Some try to guess buy the dirt or backed oil on them, some old caulk or rust on the bottom but other wise just looking at them you'll never know.


Next is a reg. glass body but with a screw on base. Narrow bodies with screw bases were 6" but wides are 7". I don't recall seeing any wide 6" base globes.

This is a reg. gill body. Screw base gill looks just like but with a screw on colar.
Notice the metal "clamp" style ring that holds the lenses. When mounting lenses you need to watch as the ring only fits on 1 way because the way it's made.
Ripples are gill bodies and look the just like this... only difference is rippled.



This is a hull body.
Notice the 2 screws that hold the lenses and not rings.

Just in case you thought all globes were made by Cincinnati Advertising.


1927


1927


1925

Jack Sim
Author, Gas Pump Identification book and Air Meter Identification book www.petrolianacollectibles.com

More globe ads:


1931


1930


1925

Jack Sim

More globe ads:


1926


1925

Jack Sim

More globe ads:


1926


1929

Here are a couple of pictures of globe lens being made at the Cincinnati Advertising Products Co. in 1924.





Jack Sim

Thanks Jack, I didn't know so many glass companys out there.

Thanks for doing this..educational

T-Way, Does your globe making area look loke that?

Very cool thanks
Larry

Ball crank globe body.


Banded body.


Thanks to t-way for the banded globe images.

[This message has been edited by Jarvis (edited 06-07-2007).]

There is a 15" glass body that is solid but uses rings like a gill. 12.5 glass bodies look like the regular 13.5 wide bodies. Also oval glass bodies are solid.

There are many differant gill sizes from 13 1/4" to 13 5/8" and 14" i think.

You will find hull bodies in different colors but ripples are the most you see in colored glass.

That pretty much covers the glass bodies unless i am forgetting something. Any questions on glass bodies before we move on to metal bodies.

JJ, your doing a great job with this. Are you going to do one piece and chimney cap globes separate?

Brian

[This message has been edited by BLange (edited 06-08-2007).]

Brain,
I wasn't going to do anything on 1 piece globes as i didn't want to get into the differences. This was going to be on bodies them selves.
Maybe later on on GOTM we can do one piece globes.

OK, I have one question, this will make me sound like a newbe, but here it goes. On the Dixie key holes, do those globes have lenses or are they baked on paint. I've never really took a good look at one. My gut feeling is that they have lenses.


Brian

I forgot I had this picture from MI Gas, looks like I'll answer my own question. LOL


Lenses.

Does anyone have a picture of a red (or yellow) hull body they can post showing how one side of the globe is open?

How about pictures of original and repro ripples?

I've seen several glass bodies that have indentations for both the regular 3 & 9 o'clock bolt pattern and the 12, 4 and 8 o'clock bolt pattern. The ones I've seen only have the holes ground for one bolt pattern or the other. Has anyone seen a globe where all 5 holes are ground?

JJ, do you have a picture of the stepped bodies that Sinclair and Richfield used?

I bought a wide body that once I received it I suspected it was a repro. I started pulling wide body globes off the shelf to compare it to. I compared it to nine known originals and it was different than all of them. In fact the nine wide bodies I already had were all different than each other! I started looking more closely at the bodies. One of them is laminated glass. The outer part of the body is clear. It has a layer of milkglass inside it.

Bob, I am not sure if i have a stepped body with taking globes off the shelf. Sinclair and Richfield used the stepped body and i think Pergal repops that stepped body.

I think my ball crank has all 5 holes in the body. I can't get to it right now to get it down and look.

I can take a picture of my repop ripple next to my original ripple to get a picture for comparison. I forgot about doing that.

Here are three more ads from 1916.







Jack Sim
Author, Gas Pump Identification book and Air Meter Identifiction book

here is an origianl ripple next to a repop.

I think that covered the glass bodies. I hope guys have a better feel for what is what on glass bodies now.

Anyone have any questions before we move on to the metal bodies?

I'm liking this JJ. Your doing a great job! Good to see GOTM back!
chris

Hey John, just wanted to say the same, great job!!!

Well time has gotten away from me and i now see it's time to start another GOTM and were not even finished here. LOL

Lets wrap this up with metal bodies.

I know the original metals were spot welded and the repop weren't but that not the case anymore. I e-mailed t-way to see if he can post a picture because he has the new bodies.

I will add this!!!!
On a 15" or 16.5" metal body at the bottom there is a dimple and the lenses are recessed. You must line these up or when the lenses go in it will break. You have to be careful putting in snap rings because these things will scare you when the snap in.

Sometimes its scary taking them out too.

[This message has been edited by Lastgas15 (edited 06-25-2007).]

MAKE SURE BODY IS NOT WARPED & lens makes contact with band ALL THE WAY AROUND, BEFORE installing the ring. I use dental floss [wrapped around a couple of times] to ease the end of ring into place. Havn't broke one YET.
db

IF, in doubt, use silcone or hot glue in 3 or 4 places on each lens. Better to be safe than sorry.

[This message has been edited by Dick Bennett (edited 06-26-2007).]

Bob, I know that feeling!!! That snap ring will fly out of there.

T-Way is going to post some pictures Wed. night for us.

Anyone have any questions on bodies before we move on?

cleaning them maybe?
Putting capco bodies together?

Okay gang - here we go.

First off is an original low-profile steel body base. This is kinda hard to see, but the base is on the 'outside' of the punched lip of the body itself. The new 'steel' low profile bodies are made exactly this way - right down to the spot welds that hold everything together.

If you look closly, you can see the lens locating 'bump' just above the RH end of the snap ring - and the seams where the ends of the rolled body come together.


Shot with CYBERSHOT at 2007-06-27

The original and reproduction steel low-profile bodies are made of two pieces. The body itself is 'rolled' - then the ends are welded together and the hole is punched for the base piece. The body is inserted into the base and the two pieces are spot welded together.

[This message has been edited by T-way (edited 06-27-2007).]

Here is a new 'steel' stamped base. These too are done exactly the same as the orignals - right down to the spot welds and the small locating 'bump' at 6:00. Note that the base is on the 'inside' of the body now.

You can see the locating bump in this photo.

If you are putting 'new' reproduction lenses in these new steel high- or low-profile bodies, you will need to take a body dolly and hammer and flatten this bump. This will allow your new lenses to sit flush with the mounting surface and not cause a stress point.


Shot with CYBERSHOT at 2007-06-27

These are made of three pieces of steel. There is a front and a back piece to the body itself and then the base piece.

The two halves are assembled by rolling the lip on one over the other. Then the hole is punched and the base is spot welded into place.

[This message has been edited by T-way (edited 06-27-2007).]

Here is one of the many new commercially available aluminum bodies.

You will note that the base profile is different from an original and that the base inserts into the body. The body is punched inward and the body hole flange and the upper edge of the base are tack welded together inside the unit.

These are three piece units. Two halves that are 'spun' for the body and a third spun base piece.


Shot with CYBERSHOT at 2007-06-27

FYI

If you are buying any reproduction steel or aluminum body - make sure to check the fit of your lenses before you paint the unit.

The new steel bodies seem to be slightly different diameters from one side to the other. So make sure both lenses will fit in both sides - with the snap rings fully seated - before proceeding to paint.

We have found that some lenses will go on one side of the bodies and seat perfectly and then not allow the snap rings to seat on the other side. I check all body/lens combinations prior to paint for just this reason.

The aluminum bodies have just the opposite problem. Sometimes they are a bit too loose and your lenses will spin easily after the snap rings are installed. Sometimes you can take up the 'play' by placing a few spots of electrical tape on the seating surface. This will usually take up the slop and allow the retaining rings to hold the lenses firmly.

The Professors idea of the flossing string is a good one for final installation. If you are just checking the fit prior to paint, put a small 'flag' of electrical tape/masking tape on one end of the retaining ring to use as a tab during removal of the rings after the test fit.

If you look at the images directly above, you can see the green masking tape flag I mentioned. This is a shot of one of the bodies I have displayed in my Production Room with lenses installed. I leave the flags on the snap rings so I can easily change out the display lenses when a new lens design becomes available.

Later . . .

Jim

[This message has been edited by T-way (edited 06-27-2007).]