Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums General Petroliana Discussion Guts or Gutless...

Gulfiend Quote "what gets me is how defensive the 'gutless' crowd is..."

Is that it or is it that they don't agree with YOU that angers you so much

...???

...dude, I'm not angry!...you mistake passion for anger...I just feel strongly about this...

...I've thought about this stuff a LOT...years of seeing pump faces/globe faces reproduced with poorly chosen fonts in place of the original lettering (due to either pure laziness, or insensitivity to design), and comically garish pump restorations - some with pump signs/decals from different companies used on the same pump(!) - have led me to the conclusion that the hobby has grown enough where it's time to establish some standards...otherwise the terms we use can mean anything, and as a result they mean nothing...there's serious money being thrown around now...playtime is over...we're not a bunch of pimply-faced kids scraping up enough paper route money to piece a jalopy hot rod together, so we can drive to high school...all restorations are NOT created equal...this isn't teeball where everyone gets a trophy...

...I honestly don't care if anyone agrees with me or not - to this point not one reply on 'the other side' has offered anything to advance their position...what kills me is the 'gutless' crowd continually falls back to the 'it's your pump, do what you want' thing...that's a cop-out, and offers nothing to further the debate...

...please, give me examples of any other historical pursuit where 'I don't care what it looked like in it's heyday - it's my _____ and I'll do what I want' is the motto...

Getting everyone to switch to 1 kind of Beer might be easier!

Hey guys,its a hobby;supposed to be for the fun of it.Are we having fun yet? Different people have different objrctives within the hobby but in my opion all are members of the hobby and should be treated with respect.

Gulfiend, I understand your point. And to relate to that, I was involved in an Airplane restoration for the Smithsonian. Their specifications stated that ALL parts, are to be made to working condition, from the same materials as the original, and marked "REPRODUCTION". For example, if a hydraulic cylinder was built with a leather seal, a steel cylinder, and a brass piston, thats exactly how we hade to reproduce it.

Your passion for authenticity is respectable, however, a substantial portion of restored pumps wind up inside the house or other places commonly visited by people. Thats probably where the "gut it to get rid of the smell" mentality comes from. And that seems to be the commonly accepted way to display your/our gas pumps. It also seems that gas pumps ARE the only things restored in this manner.

Mark, You and I are friends and I applaud your passion. Having restored a few pumps myself, it is my personal preferance to gut them. Does it lower the current or future value...who really knowns? If I could be sure of the future, maybe I wouldn't have lost so much in the stock market???? What I'd like to point out is that a lot has been discussed concerning this subject and I personally feel that there will be no clear rules set forth....Why not do what ever you want and quit overthinking it? As always, my opinion is only worth what you paid for it! Best regards, Paul

gulfiend: I appreciate your passion and you certainly are entitled to your opinion and they are certainly welcome here.

For me it's simple, I'm not restoring MY pumps for any historical significance or pursuit. I'm restoring them for the pursuit of my happiness and contentment.

If in your book that makes me a bad hobbyist then I'm okay with that.

Hi guys, I'm pretty new here, but thought I would through in a little something to this topic. I haven't started on any of my pumps yet, but had been planning on gutting all of mine for restoration. But I may give it a second thought after reading this. I don't know, I guss I lean more toward gutting, but it seems like having the guts makes the pump somewhat more authentic. My question is, and I'm still nieve to a lot in this hobby, but can't you pretty much buy everything repo for a Wayne 60? Well, maybe everything but the veeder root. So how does that effect the future value of my original Wayne 60's as more and more repo parts are being made for these pumps? Or is it easy to tell the difference between the repo parts compared to the original Wayne parts? That's something I have wondered about recently, and now that I have found this site, hopefully you guys can give me some insight. The reason I ask, is if having the guts still intact, maybe that would make the pump more authentic. What are your thoughts? Hopefully I haven't got too far off subject and hijacked the post. If I have, I apoligize in advance.

I have been biting my tongue, for most of today and I'm done. Pumps were used...HARD. I bet most of them had/have parts that weren't on the "build sheets". Parts were expensive, the operator used whatever he could to ensure the pump worked, including bailing wire, cardboard and tape. This included using parts from other manufacturers' pumps. A true "shadetree mechanic" would use parts that no pump manufacturer would have ever used. They used paint brushes to paint the pump when the door dings, paint removal by the hose rubbing on the side and the occasional "poor" driver inflicted on the pump, got real bad. Plus the damage weather and the service station/gas station attendant did to them. "Historical value"? They had so much value that up until the late 70's they were crushed and used as "fill" in station driveways. No one knows what the future will bring, in the way of prices. No one knows right now if prices reflect a difference based on whether a pump has it's "guts" or not. It isn't a "cop out" to say it is up to the owner to do what they want with their pump, it is reality.

There was talk of "Standards", who will set these standards? Anyone here have that knowledge and expertise? Jack, db and others here, with much more knowledge than I will ever have, aren't too proud to say that they learn new things about pumps, all the time.

If someone doesn't want to follow said standards, what would happen to them? Kick in their doors in the "dead of night" and take their pump(s), because they want to own THEIR PUMP ... THEIR WAY?

Ofcourse not, so why worry about everyone doing everything the same? Instead, how about everyone worry only about your own pumps and let everyone else worry about theirs?

amen!!!

I second that. Well said, Bob.

I recently found a Sunoco Wayne 511 blender that I wanted to bring into the house,as well as have it complete to the year it was last inspected..1970.I took the guts out and slowly rinsed them out with bleach & solvents and let them air dry for nearly a year..I then installed the parts slowly and securely,thank god I could document the parts before removing with a digital camera.
Today I have the pump in my living room,and there is no hint of a gas smell.The majority of the gas smell came from the original fuel filters,so I leave them in the garage.
Not once did I repaint it anywhere,nor use any repoped parts.I also found an original DX gas grade chart dated 1960-67 in it's original frame.
I feel fortunate & happy to have it this way,but do understand why so many don't have their original plumbing today.
I respect it more & more now with the understanding of it's original intent.
Put me down for wanting a pump with it's guts still intact.
Rick





Here it is today,both sides fully loaded,detailed,cleaned & complete.

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Vintage lock & key too..