Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums General Petroliana Discussion What does a book value really mean?

I was just looking over the "What's worth page" and I noticed alot of people submitting a book value price on signs and pumps.I posted this in hopes of getting a feel for how everyone else feels on this topic.In todays economy especially in my area where it took longer to feel the crunch due to a large concentration of manufacturing plants.I've noticed prices are definatly dropping on everything due to nobody having the cash to spend.Lets face it most are worried about keeping a roof over there head none the less a two thousand dollar sign to hang in the man cave.How are these book values being determind?actual sales at auctions,swap meets what have you?And do you feel the prices are correct.I have seen several post where people are giving prices that no way even on a good day with the buyer being blind,or mentally challenged could you get that price.

Out here in my neck of the woods in Kansas, I've seen the prices actually go up the last couple of years. I think the prices here have always been a little higher than average just because there wasn't as many stations out here therefore there is less supply of old signs and pumps. I've gone to a couple of auctions recently where old beat up signs went for crazy money. I believe American Pickers and the like have brought many new people to the auctions and the swap meets who are not collectors but think they can use these pumps, signs, and globes as investments or sommething. I thought the Matthews auction yesterday brought some pretty good money. too. So far I'd have to disagree that the economy here has negatively affected prices.

The dedicated petroliana guides' valuations I'm not as familiar with, but the Kovels guides are flea market prices and the Garage sale guides are--garage sale prices.
There are databases with updated prices, too, that your public library might subscribe to: p4a is an example. It takes prices from eBay and other auctions. I just can't see how prices can be extrapolated across years, especially those from before 2007.
Rarity estimates, yes. Pricing, no. I've noticed prices dropping like a rock around here (Chicago 'burbs) on nearly everything I collect.

I would have to agree Maps.I collected post war Lionel trains some years ago and know a check of prices on ebay would reflect a serious loss of money for my collection.The same canbe said for my collection of antique and classic car parts.The stock common parts are very cheap and have little demand anymore.even at Hershey.I also can see skinfxr point.Some of the prices maybe a reflection of location.A perfect example would be milk bottles.obviously a milk bottle from pa would have little to no value say in California.But what about the Carlisle and Hershey swap meets.There are people from all over at these and most have a similar price on the same item.This very interesting to me to see what everyone has to say about this.

I've never used a value guide and never will for pricing, I just use them for reference on the size, etc.
As for the economy effecting the hobby, I don't believe that for a second, it is just used as a bargaining tool for buyers. Prices on damaged and rusted signs are out of this world at local auctions, and the same goes for Mint and rare signs.

There are people losing their homes everywhere every week, but I have still not been able to buy any Sign or Gas Pump at even close to a reasonable price for a couple years now at any auctions.

I agree with Rick, prices are strong and hard to find any items priced fairly. There are some deals to be found but you must do the leg work. I do not buy at auctions because generally you are paying top dollar for an item. Once in a while you may find a deal. Book values are not something to rely on. Many of the Petro books are outdated and the values given are only as good as the resource and the time they were given. As Rick said the value guides are great for sizes and small details on items. I have come to realize not all guides have the correct sizes of signs. For pricing I rec. paying what you feel is fair after doing some leg work. You cannot know every item out there and sometimes when you see something you are not near a computer. This is the main reason one should watch the market so you will have an idea.

Prices seen in a price guide are the author's opinions. Probally an educated opinion, but as you can see from oldgas value forum, everyone has a different opinion.

What does a book value really mean?

IMO...not a whole lot. Books are a great resource for manufacturer info, style, et.. but in regards to price the book is dated once values are added. The economy and ever changing habits of the hobby render any written price guide obsolete in a matter of a few yeas.

When I wrote the Gas Pump ID book, the criteria for pricing was the "Pump to be unrestored, in near 100% completion, excluding any globe shown on the pump."

But...the biggest factor affecting any of the prices shown in the book is "location."

I recently tried to purchase a Fry 117, it was in Chicago (I am in St. Louis), it would have cost me at least $400 to drive there, take someone with me, unattach the pump, stay in a motel for one night, maybe two, feed us both, so I offered her $1200.00. If I had lived in the area I would have given her $1800-1900. for the pump.

A lot of factors effect the prices of anything, the economy is just one of them.

Jack Sim

I only use price guides (if at all) to determine or compare which widget is more valuable/desirable than the other. The actual price is irrelevant as there are just too many factors to take into account.

Wow,looks like I have found another interesting topic that I find interesting is what Gas/Oil brands are most desireable in your area.Or are they about the same no matter your location.Correct me if I'm wrong but what I have gathered from this posting I started is that location plays the biggest part in the price.But as I mentioned futher up the thread.I go to both Carlisles(Spring and Fall) and also to Hershey and people do come from all over to set up and sell and the prices are pretty even on most the stuff regardless of there home location.

You're going to get pretty much the same answer across the board regarding price guides, regardless of location or even collecting interest. With the internet, I would say location is down the list unless you have to factor in gas and hotel to get your item as Jack mentioned.

The economy has most definitely affected prices on many collectibles, not just petroliana. The best of the best still command strong prices, and junk seems to be overpriced, but most stuff in between is down from 2007 or early 2008. The low end stuff brings more at local auctions than at specialty petro auctions.
As far as what "book value" means.....it means very little. Price guides are just that...guides. They are not meant to be the final say in determining value. Also, the values in some guides appear to be w.a.g.'s and have no basis in reality.
Location does have an affect on prices, but it's usually not the most important factor. Desirability (visual appeal/graphics, collectability of the company.....Gilmore tops the list as highly collectible vs. say new logo Mobil not being very collectible). Rarity can play a factor as well, but rarity alone doesn't make an item desirable.
If you really want to learn about prices you need to check completed auction results on ebay, Matthews and other specialty auction results, network with other collectors and dealers, and go to the shows. The only thing that might have worse pricing info than the price guides are the values mentioned on TV and by some very uninformed people on message boards. In other words, if you want accurate pricing info you'll need to do your own homework.

I wish all sellers were as open mined about price guides as the people posting here.

I am still looking for the person that paid $250.00 for a 2 gallon Wake-Up oil can. I have several I want to sell him. That is what one of my collectable books list it at.

Because aunt Marge found a rare 1 quart in a grade 6 condition and the price book shows a grade 9 for $65.00. That is what her's is worth.

That being said, I am not a Can collector per say, and I probably wouldn't recognise a $1000.00 oil can for $5.00 if I saw it, so there is a flip side....