Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums General Petroliana Discussion Aumann Auction

Boy oh boy. Some good buys on signs today, except for the Willys sign I wanted SO badly. I don't collect globes however some of those prices looked very good as well. Onc never knows what to expect at an auction. Anyway...if anyone runs across one of the Willys Service signs I am willing to pay a strong price. I was right behind the winning bidder who was on site.
Ray Seider

Good stuff brought strong money, ok stuff brought ok money. As expected, the dealership stuff went nuts, the picture globes also. I watched most of the day. $6000 for the Dodge Trucks sign seemed overly strong. The Willys Overland Ray is referring to brought like $3500, which is pretty high. I sold one in the same condition two years ago for $1300. But I'd only given $675 for it, so, oh well.

I thought that some of the prices were pretty good...there were some good deals to be had....lots of fun!!!

I have never been to a auction like this, do the prices always make sense or does it vary on who is there?


Travis E. Towle
Topeka, Kansas

785-357-1004

Maybe this should be a new topic,and no harm intended here and I hope everyone had a blast this weekend but I am trying to understand how this Aumann auction thing works.What is the buyers premium for?Every gas collector that I talk to thinks that this is a gigantic ripoff.Isnt the owner of the items already paying a percentage of the money collected.If I understand everything correct,arent they making double money???? I think this takes away from guys trying to buy more things.Can someone explain this?

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Steve...this topic has been cussed & discussed at length. And granted, my sale is completely different in that the items for sale are only about 20% mine, and I am not an auctioneer, so I am hiring an auctioneer. So in my sale, I am the promotor and they are the auctioneer. In my auction, the sellers commission is intended to cover the cost of hiring the auction house, hiring 10 extra to people to work for a week, renting a facility, renting porta-potties, bringing in 3 phone lines for bidspotter, hiring a private security guard (24 hours a day for 3 days), and credit card processing fees (3% and everybody pays with credit cards!). That is just what I can think of off the top of my head. The seller's commission will cover this in some years, and in some years it won't. The buyer's premium, for me, was brought about to cover the cost of advertising only. I spent $5000 for print advertising (PCM CTO ANTIQUE WEEK, ETC) for this years auction. I also printed 30,000 6 page color brochures ($7500) and mailed them first class (23,300 for .39 = $9000). So there is $21,500 in advertising that would otherwise not have been covered by the seller's commission. That is why I enacted a buyer's premium. These are real numbers, not fantasy. I've done this for 9 straight years and without the buyer's premium, I coudn't do the sale. NOW, if the merchandise were all mine, it might be a different story.

Every time I am on the buy side of an auction, yes, the buyer's premium is no fun. But I can assure you, without it, a sale like mine would cease. I am not speaking for Aumann nor do I have any idea what their system or costs are. This is just my explanation of why I have to charge a buyer's premium. I have my auction for 2 reasons, 1. to sell a bunch of pumps at once and 2. to bring new customers into my shop for a weekend. It's NOT because there is big money to be made off the promotion-side of an auction.

[This message has been edited by Seth Robbins (edited 01-29-2006).]

Hi Seth,

Sent you a couple of email but haven't heard from you, not sure if you received them.
Glenn

The e-mail attached to oldgas, goes to my shop, I will see them monday morning. You can reforward to robbins61@cox.net. Seth

Thanks Seth, email is on the way.

Wow, Have been following this auction the past couple of days. I thought some items were very reasonable. Some of the premium items brought what was expected I am sure. I see that Crown globe sold for $10,000 and a couple of others weren't too far behind.

I also thought the gas pumps went very reasonably. I liked the visible Sunoco for $1400.

As far as auction premiums go, some do charge a buyers premium, if they do they usually don't charge the sellers or cosigners as much. Around here auctioneers get 30% commission. Sometimes they charge the seller 20% and a buyers prem. of 10%. Good for the sellers. I guess the auction houses think they will attract better items this way. I don't like paying an extra 10% as a buyer but I just have to figure that into my bid, so it will actually lower what I will bid in the end. Some auction places just charge the sellers 30% and no buyers premium. Internet bidding usually has a higher premium because of all the costs involved, but it allows buyers a chance to bid at auctions we can't go to.

Auctioneers have a lot of costs to cover. Advertising, web site maintenience, employees, rent, electric, etc...People don't realize how much work goes into organizing and cataloging a auction.

Each auction house is a liitle different. Obviously your higher end auction houses have a lot more resources than a little local "Saturday Night" auction house and the costs are reflected. I can't imagine Rex going with one of these smaller outfits. Aumann costs more but look at the exposure they generate....we can actually follow Rex's auction as it unfolds. How cool is that! That costs Aumann some money to do.

It all works out in the end. I hope Mr. Benson was happy with everything. Hopefully we will be able to read his thoughts on all this.

Great post 59Fairlane.....my sellers commission and buyer's premium are less than 25% combined. Most auctioneers in this part of the country charge 20% to the seller than they (the seller) pay all the expenses too, (advertising, rental, etc) so I'm sure they equal your 30%.

I notice that on Rex's/Aumann auction that there is less notations of "condition rating 1-10" in the item descriptions. I know this rating is subjective, although sometimes the pictures don't always due the piece justice. I wish Aumann would put additional pics of each item to help the online bidder.

Don't get me wrong here. I'm not beating up on anyone, just stating an opinion base on my observation. I am a happy customer of both the Aumann auctions and Vic's 66 and think they do a good job.

Anyone have an opinion on why the grading of items is appearing less?

Regards,
Kim

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Great topic....this year we are going to try and put as high quality of pictures as the system will allow of both sides of each item (if it's double-sided). Grading is a tough one, because one guys' 9 is another guys' 8, one guy's mint is another guys' 9. Pics sometimes don't do items the justice they deserve and sometimes pictures don't show all the flaws. My suggestion would be, if you are in doubt, call in the week before. Case in point....I bought a Conoco sign at an auction in Texas last fall that was advertised as a '9' on the internet. When I got it it was about 35% poorly touched up. I called in not so much to complain, but rather to see who's '9' this was, and they told me it displayed like a '9', which is kinda true, I guess. I would've rather them not put a grade on it so maybe my expectations wouldn't have been so high.

What was up with that Tokheim visible done in Sunoco that went for $1400? And they had to work to get THAT. Did it have an acrylic cylinder and lousy paint job?

I thought that was a bit too cheap, or am I wrong? Shouldn't it have brought more in the neighborhood of 2700-3000 dollars at least?

Does this indicate pump values have peaked and are going soft?? You can sink 1400 bucks into a pump just in restoration costs alone if you do it right....... What do you guys say that were at the sale...I was home on the computer....

Midway, The Tokheim pump was very nicely restored. The paint looked awesome. I dont know if it was acrylic or glass but I know the top was fiberglass. I think it was a great buy at $1400. It seems the buyers were after globes and signs at this auction.

Talked to Kim tonight and he said that the gloves were going very cheap?Has our hobby took a hit in the pockets or what?I am going totake a look at the results tonight!Hope Rex is happy,probably on his way to Hawaii!!!!!

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The high-end stuff brought high-end money, bottom-line. Globes can be rare as hen's teeth, but when they aren't picture globes and when there are hundreds of them, some are bound to start going cheap. That is the nature of an auction. In our auction last year, Rex himself bought some Crown globes that he considered rare for like the $300-$500 range, while a single Clipper lens brought $5000, a Tex Ethyl on glass brought $2500, a 1pc baked Sinclair brought $3500 and a Veltex brought $3000. I watched the sale....I saw the following including BP:
Olds Globe=$5000+, Gargoyle $3000+, 1pc Red Crown=$11,000, Tower $2900, Magnolia $9000, Pontiac Sign $8000, Dodge Trucks Sign $6600, Olds Rocket Sign $9000+. Then I saw a bunch of capco, text only, 1-color globes bring $200-$400. It all seemed pretty typical to me....and as far as pumps go, I've never had good success with restored stuff in an auction. Here's a good example:
2 years ago I had an unrestored Roman Column bring $10,000 at my sale. The following year, I restored one (Roman) to Pollygas and it brought $10,900. What I am saying is, most times my experience has been that pumps will bring about what they should if they were unrestored regardless if they are restored or not. Last year, I sold a 541 restored to Shamrock for $1200 and 5 minutes later sold an unrestored for 541 for $900. Auctions are odd...just like I typed to Rex last week, "Some stuff is going to go really high, some stuff is going to go really low, but at the end you are going to get a big check". Sounds like buyer & seller alike won in this auction.

That's kind of scary Seth, on the value of restored pumps. I watched a Wayne Cut 615 in shabby condition sell for three grand at a sale in Des Moines last summer. The pump really needed to be taken apart, stripped completely, and totally re-done. But there were two guys bent on owning the pump, and I guess that is what an auction is all about!! So more power to 'em. I have a VERY solid and original Rush Model K (minus the cylinder that I broke taking the pump apart) that still had original Phillips 66 black and orange paint. Looking back I guess I should have just left it alone, but it looks a lot better now sandblasted and re-painted....

I hope many of you are going to be at Seth's auction. I've gone every year since it started and always come home with something. Some good buys and some bad but Seth has some GREAT stuff this year
Ray

Midway...I think the thing about restored pumps and auctions is that the kind of person who is going to pay top dollar for a restored gas pump is not the kind of person who is going to travel 1/2-way across the country to go to a collectibles auction. Most of the pump buyers that come to my auction are also restorers. I know as a restorer, that I generally don't buy other restorations, unless they are cheap. Also, most guys that buy pumps at the oil and gas auctions seem to be buying them for resale. It's a weird phenomenon, but for the most part, I'm money ahead to sell unrestoreds at auction.

Thanks for the encouragement Ray.