Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums General Petroliana Discussion Gutting

I see post were guys find pumps to resale and gut them. Why does everyone do this? I like my pumps to have the guts. I'm sure others do too. If your going to resale it why not leave it up to the buyer.

The guts are really heavy and have no real value. No one will ever use it for what it was intended for again. Most people just want a pump that looks cool, and that's it. Why add 250+ pounds to a restored pump. Also, the guts stink, and will leak old fuel. You'll never be able to get all the old gas out. Why do all the extra work of fixing up the guts when they add nothing to the finished product.

I think that that may be OK on a Very, Very rare pump, but all these common pumps are really nothing but lawn ornaments anyway.
As stated, I really hate it when you move one and it spills old gas or diesel all over and you have a mess to clean up!
If you want to buy pumps with the guts in them, I think all you'd have to do is advertise for the brand and model you want, and someone will find it for you.

They're not like Hot Rods, They'll NEVER be used to pump gas again.
As a seller, IF your taking a load to a swap meet, you can haul 3-4 w/ guts in a pickup OR 6-8 w/o guts. 95% of collectors buying a pump at a swap meet won't consider one w/ guts, UN-less as KW said it's a rare pump.

This is from our Frequently Asked Questions forum, the first forum on the forum list:


There are several "right" answers to this:

1. Removing the guts lightens the gas pump assembly making it easier to move. It also eliminates most of the smelly and possibly hazardous gasoline residue.

2. Leaving the guts in pumps left outside makes them tougher to steal and more stable in strong winds.

3. Leaving the guts in visible pumps provides a place for attachment of the outside handle and gives some low weight to help with top-heavy instability.

4. If a gas pump has an unusual or rare pump mechanism, it would be prudent to leave it all together for history's sake.

Except for the situations mentioned above, it doesn't hurt the resale value of a vintage gas pump to remove the guts to all but the most purist collector. Removal also makes a pump more compatible with displaying inside a house.

I understand that it reduces the weight. I just like mine to have the guts. I like to "tinker" and try to make them work again even though I'd never use it to pump gas again. So I see guys post that a pump is only original once and I feel like once the guts are gone its not the same anymore. Kinda like taking rover in to be castrated. There never the same LOL

If one even wanted to use a gas pump again for it's original use, most insurance companies won't even look at you with a policy. I know this as my wife has worked in claims with Country Companies for years. When I did my first visible for my father on our farm in 1981, I was going to make it a working piece of art. Was cautioned by the better half that CC would NOT write a farm policy with the visible anywhere near a building. Now years later they won't write a policy if it is any where on the property. Just my two cents worth. Rob

Something functional like a jukebox or coke machine...absolutely. A visible pump which usually needs the pump to support the handle...yes. An electric pump...almost never unless you are setting a booby trap for thieves. It will stink up a room and put undue stress on your floor. These guys are right...voices of experience. Move one by yourself one time up steps and over a threshold using an appliance truck and your sperm count will be dramatically reduced.
Dave

Plus you can get extra spending money by selling the scrap pump mechanism to the scrap yard ;.)

Exceptions would be with Visible Hand operated & Curb pumps [pre-visibles].

I totally understand why its done. It just makes it harder for guys like me, that like pumps to have guts, when everyone guts them assuming the person thats going to buy it wants it like that.

Thanks for all the feedback.

Many collectors feel as you do.
Once flippers make the decision for you & gut em because they have a bad back,you can nearly never find their parts again.

Hang on to them..

Miken

Have you ever taken the pump assemble found in a computer pump apart. If you had, you will find at least a gallon of the worst smelling gasoline you even smelt (I make up that word).
Actually, if you do want to keep the pump and meter in the pump, take them apart, drain all the residue and reassemble the units.

Don't just restore the pump by leaving these items in the pump and doing nothing about them. Just one little movement of that wheel on the side of the pump will bring around a section of the meter that holds old gasoline, and it will run out on the floor of the customer you sold the pump to.

So, if you really think the guts should be in the pump, be sure to take them all apart and clean out all the old gasoline.

Jack Sim

I gutted a tall 39 two weeks ago and a least two gallons came out. The hose was still full, the sight glass maifold was full and the meter was completely full.

Here's the brutal honesty for those who desire the guts remain in the pumps. Pay extra for a pump with guts above what everyone else will pay for the same pump without the guts. And I'm not talking $50 more. Because of the 2 main drawbacks of those guts, extra weight & hazardous liquids, leaving them in doesn't make the seller any more money.

Think of it this way, the guy who buys a matching numbers vintage car is willing to pay substantially more than a non-matching numbers car.

Pay a guy an extra 30-40% for those guts in place and you'll see some segment of the market respond.

...'brutal honesty' from a picker? wow...

...I guess that makes me a purist, because I'd rather have an entire pump than one that's been monkeyed with...cars that sit in a static museum display are likely never going to be driven again; their engines/transmissions, etc., weigh considerably more than gas pump guts and are never seen; and the majority of people who admire old cars do so because of the body styling...

...also, it seems as though those with large collections of gutted pumps have a vested interest in saying 'it doesn't matter' - because if it did, their collections would be perceived as less valuable...

...I was once offered a gutted pump, only to discover that the person had 'over-gutted' it, and there was nothing to attach the visigauge to...

I find it so interesting that the people endorsing the gutted pumps,are the people selling the gutted pumps.

Real collectors seem to want the pumps with their guts left in em,but unfortunately the "fast flippers" or sellers get to em first & gut em because they have a "bad back",and then justify it by saying no one wants the guts left in em.................oh really?

When I look for pumps I ask and try to find them with guts. Sometimes I dont have a choice. It does make it harder to find. I think leaving the guts in gives you more potential buyers that my have passed on it had it been gutted. I know some say the guts don't mean anything but they were apart of the pump that once removed you can never find again.

Gutting hasn't hurt the value of old Fords having their engines swapped out w/ Chevy engines! It's the Body that most are after.

I beg to differ.
A pristinely restored Ford,Chrysler,Chevy or anything else will always be more admired & sought after if it has it's original factory drivetrain intact between it's body.
No matter how much a vehicle with a replacement drivetrain sells for,it would be trumped in price by an identical vehicle in the exact condition holding it's born with engine-trans-rear.

I agree tell your insurance provider you have 20 non gutted pumps in the old man cave and see if he doesn't freak out. Got them in the garage better but lots of garages ae attached now days. I agree that demand would somewhat drive the market. The old tall visables I'm on the fence about as they are top heavy- but aren't they all ready heavy enough without the pump. Something to be said for complete orginal only once but for me gutt-em.

Right on Rick.

Why the negativity and the divisiveness?

Why attack or label someone because they expressed their opinion?
"...'brutal honesty' from a picker? wow..."

Why divide the ranks as "real collectors" and what; fake collectors?

Express your opinion and move on, no need to slam anyone. Why is it so hard to respect those that hold a differing opinion!

For the record; I gut my short and tall electric's. Visibles and clock faces I keep intact. I respect everyone's else to do what ever they want with their pumps.

...Dave, he labelled himself as a picker: 'Paul's Picks'...

Yep, I pick and sell Gulfiend and brutal honesty gets it's name for being brutal. I know far more paying customers who prefer no guts on pumps that don't need them.

Next time I find any pump complete you gonna pay me 30-40% more than the market pays for a gutted version? If you're not willing to put money in my hand for the extra grief why should I call you first when I get a pump? No reason whatsoever.

Common pumps just aren't that important to be hassling about guts/no guts for a Tokheim 39, Gilbarco 906, etc.

Unlike vintage automobiles which can actually perform a useful function as transportation, gas electric pumps from the old units won't be put to any use by 99.9999% of those who leave them in. You'll find more old lubesters in use than gas pumps because they are still useful and worth buying functional.

Why not polish gas pump parts with gas pump parts ...and they work great!!!

Not meant to divide ranks Dave,in mentioning people who act like collectors.




If you're both going to use this as an argument,then why not go all the way & say this about the entire gas pump itself as well as collecting full oil cans.
All of em are on display today & not used what initially intended for.
If every person from here on out,gutted their gas pump,there would be a best selling book released 10 years from now entitled:
"How a Gas Pump Originally Pumped Gas",with no illustrations.

LOL, I like the repurposing.


BTW, the pump book won't come out until people use only electricity to power their vehicles and only have to drive over a charging spot and get a trickle charge through their tires.

...what I want to know is: if you're literally doing nothing but moving an extra 150-200 lbs. from one place to another, and that alone justifies a 30-40% markup (on a $500 pump, that's another $150-200), what markup does the 'extra grief' of actually gutting the pump justify?

LOL - As a picker I don't remove the pump myself, it's too much trouble. I tend to look for pumps where it's already been removed because they do sell quicker, are easier to move, and can carry more of them as necessary. But if you want me to handle a pump-included unit then you should pay me more for my grief.

For over 20 yrs I've used the same gas pump motor to power my 9" South Bend Metal Lathe. A friend re-wired it to run both directions. I've run it long enough that you couldn't touch the casing, let it cool some & run again!

Great idea for the motor. Ingenuity like that is what has made this country great, the ability to see beyond a created purpose.

In all seriousness, I worry about people who get wound up in everything remaining original, especially when tens of thousands or millions of an item were created. The human mind can appreciate both the original as well as a modified form. We aren't speaking of a Mona Lisa class of item here. And you can bet the guy who designed a gas pump in the 20s never envisioned a person 90 years later willing to buy it just for display in some collection. He would laugh at such a thing you can be sure.

I think the creator of a 1940s Gilbarco electric pump would be more jazzed by Dick's use!

...what I want to know is: if you're literally doing nothing but moving an extra 150-200 lbs. from one place to another, and that alone justifies a 30-40% markup (on a $500 pump, that's another $150-200), what markup does the 'extra grief' of actually gutting the pump justify? [/quote]

That says it all right there folks !!!

All about the buck. LOL

I find it ironic that some collectors think pickers are all about the buck, yet they will willingly pay some other collector more for a similar piece. Some may attend an auction and overpay for something that I could have saved them more than Buyer Premium on.

Anyway, done with this topic.

I have a bunch of pumps all original and all with guts that work. Every time I rearrange the garage or need to do something in there and have to move the extra 250 LBS I think *****!! Why am I doing this to myself? Even though they can, I will never use them in my collection to work again. the dilemma remains what to do?

Please YOURSELF, Very Few could ever please someone else using their money [or taking it].

WOW

VERY WELL SAID.

Agreed... i love it when the pickers I know send me a text or email with pictures of things before they list them for sale, so I have a chance to make an offer.

I see no difference in buying/trading with a picker as compared to doing the same with a collector or auction. I would imagine any collector on here would become a picker if someone called them up and said 'come take a look at what I have and make me some offers'

I personally just try to buy or 'pick' enough stuff to trade or sell so that I can get the items I want to keep without dipping into my daily income funds.

I have pickers stop by my place regularly and sell me items. I'm always grateful when they do and always let them know that I appreciate the fact that they stopped by.

I don't mind them making money or the fact that they are in it for only the money. They are usually making less on the item compared to what it would cost me to take a day off of work and the cost of travel and meals.

I find it easier to buy from a picker then a collector. Much easier to fork out a few extra bucks and motivate a picker. Much more difficult to overcome the emotional attachment that collectors have. Plus you have to pay the collectors markup as more then likely the piece originated from a picker at some point.

Bottom line, it's signs I collect. Not personalities or peoples reasons for selling or the depth of their attachment to money...who cares about that. Sell me a sign and I'll overlook your shortcoming's!

Dave, I'll trade ya a 36B Top for a Station Lighter I don't have!
Better the S.L., Better the Top.

My friend that will be doing the paint and stuff on my Dual parking meter build, just finished 2 Wayne 70s. 1 has the side ad glass and the other does not.(pictured)
They will be going BACK INTO SERVICE, at a undisclosed location for a farm that has a amazing collection. (I was told because I have not had the privilege of seeing it,,,,yet???)
,, the but is that they will use the veeder root and the pipes but a modern pump will be installed so, even a completely restored pump that is actually going back into service somewhere will have different guts.
I always leave them in because the first pump I had, I went to all the trouble of takng the guts out just to have the guy pick them up out of my yard art area and take them with the pump. If someone wants me to remove them I might.?