Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums General Petroliana Discussion flying A black wing ?

got a email asking what year this flying A black wing is ?
not familiar with this as I've never seen this before
was told this was bought by Mike & Frank on latest Pickers show.
your 2¢ .. ...

I don't like the 2nd E in service...

Does not look right at all. No detail in the wings. Almost looks as if the wing were painted over black. Porcelain chips are since the black was done though.

Whether it's real or not, it looks like JUNK to me, compared with the regular ones with white wings. I wouldn't touch it...

BrianH

They are rare. I have seen one in person but agree with above post. If I had one I would sell or trade it. White wings with black accents look way better.

Great conversation and interesting observations about the sign!

However...my looming question concerns Mike’s buying it on American Pickers. With so many shadows hanging over its authenticity it really surprised me that it was purchased as absolutely authentic without any questions being raised by him! Pretty expensive roll of the dice on his part!

I would like to add one thing, that I forgot to mention.... It's not like they forgot to ad the white to the wings before the sign was finished at the factory because (as with most signs) the white was laid down first, which is evident in the chips in the first pic above. Therefore the white in the wings would've been finished already.

I don't ever recall seeing a sign where the same color was laid down twice. And for the most part, I believe colors were usually laid down lightest first to darkest last.

-Steve

photo c. 2003

Wouldn't be the first time Mike & Frank got taken!

Nice shot from the Peotone swap meet.....I'm the guy in blue, with his back to the camera. Wow, was that 2003? Could be, I guess, since I had a lot more hair in the photo than now. John

Hi John, no that was taken at the Metro Petro show in Jersey. It was the year the show was in the big gym at the former location and a lot of the local roads were flooded.

I know of one that's been hanging in a Florida collection probably since the early 1990's. I think it's a 5' to 6' sign for I've been trying to buy it forever. To me it looks real and India production wasn't around back then...plus no one made a die-cut reproduction that size back then either. Got to be real.

The seller of the one in c. 2003 MP photo is a member here, he does not sell reproductions.

Thanks for the gentle correction about your photo being from the Metro Petro gas/oil show in New Jersey (not Peotone. IL), my friend. How embarrassing. The guy in the far right looks quite like me, at least from behind. And, what really threw me was the plastic shelving sections being used on the far right vendor's swap table. That is exactly how I set up my vending space. Based on your location comment, I put on my reading glasses and got a magnifying glass out. Of course, you are right. I still admire that guy's fairly decent crop of hair, and rugged good looks...at least from behind! Thanks for the fun, MetroPetro. John

There were a couple people making porcelain signs in the 80s and 90s and to me, these feel like a "piquadio special" but I could be wrong.? I have come across some weird ones around here because of that person and a couple others, like another I heard of up in BC. This is one of the more obvious ones (and not porcelain) but there are others, that I've seen and touched, that are not as easy to pick out, and Many fake lenses from those folks too.
The best way I know to confirm originality of a sign is to find a old pic of one in use and I've seen a lot of Flying A station original pics and not one with a black wing, but, again, I could be wrong. Getting your hands on a original dealer advertising catalog is another sure way to know.

Hey all,

I have great news regarding these Flying A black winged signs! I spoke with the original owner of one and he is a long-time, experienced collector.

I know we were just having a discussion up above, but...

They are legit. They are real. And they are rare!

So if you come across one, grab it.

-Steve

Steve...thanks for the info...this is great to know. For discussion sake...my question is were the black winged flying A signs purposefully made or some sort of a fluke...like a penny with Lincoln’s head off center?

Also...Bob...thanks for your input. It looks like you joined so that you could defend your sign. I understand...but I would invite you to indeed “come on in”. We all can learn from each other and you have helped us today. I have learned so much from the nuances of the discussions plus the formats for honest and authentic buying and selling. I really appreciate what you added to the discussion. There has been a lot of interest and consternation since Mike picked the black winged flying A sign on American Pickers. Thank you for your input and I hope that you will continue to be a part.
Steve

Several posts were removed from this thread at the request of two members

Funny thats just what Mike said when he bought the black wing sign..

My sign was purchased from a long time sign collector in California who found it laying on top of the roof of an old gas station in California in the 60’s-70’s. He owned it up until I acquired it. I’m a long time collector as well and only sell when I either don’t have room for something, tired of it, or want some extra money for other signs, as I’m sure most of you do. So I’m just defending my sign as anyone would.


This will make number 4 know of this sign (My sign, the one found on American Pickers 2019, the one posted in 2003 by username Dwaine Buck on oldgas, and the one username metropetro just posted from a 2003 gas show.


This sign is not being reproduced or a fantasy piece. The black wings are not painted on, they are porcelain. When it’s in your hands you can tell it is not a reproduction/fantasy piece. Nor was anyone reproducing signs this big or with die cut wings back then. The wear is also noticeable easy to tell it is authentic. The wear pattern is not consistent with the other 3 examples as you can see. If you look at any reproduction sign made they always have the same type of wear pattern. The wear also does not have the signature red rusty run streaks as most fake signs do. The amount of mounting holes are another clue, that it’s original Most repo/fantasy signs only have 2-4 holes or less. Also the color of the porcelain on the backside is similar to other original signs Flying A and Tydol have used. The quality of the porcelain and the straightness of the letters and of the wings, is also proof of an original sign. As far a rarity this is the rarest seeing how nobody has any information about it. Mine is also the best condition out of the other 3 known.

This would not be a mistake/misprint seeing that they’re 4 examples now known, they would not have made 4 signs all with the same error. Plus 4 with a so called mistake surviving till today would be astronomical odds. As someone stated “if they were mistakes they would have been trashed.” So 4 of them would not have made it out of the factory and saved.

If any of you seen it in person and could put your hands on it. I guarantee you would see that it is real deal. It would be nice to hear from the other 3 people who own one, or if there is anyone else out there with one. I hope someone can provide a photo of this sign in use, or provide more details about this sign with facts rather than just opinions/thoughts.

Here are the 4 known examples side by side: